A common question asked of me (and others) is:
I started hooking up with this girl, but I want to turn it into a relationship now. How do I do that?
The answer to that question involves many different facets, but the bottom line is that if you’re asking that question, you’ve probably already done it wrong and are now in damage control mode.
The frame of the relationship actually starts at the first moment of the first date (or first real-life interaction). As I’ve already explained here, your frame during the dating / seduction phase should be 85% player, 15% provider, and it should be so with all women.
If you exude 100% player, you’ll get a one night stand, perhaps a two night stand, and then you’ll likely never see her again.
If all you want are one night stands, then that’s fine. But if you’re entertaining the possibility of getting into some kind of ongoing relationship with someone (serious or casual doesn’t matter), you need to use 85/15 with all women, because, and this is important, you won’t know if you’ll want a relationship with her until after you’ve spent some time with her. If you’re exuding 100% player and then decide after five hours of face time that you want an ongoing relationship with her, you’ve already damaged your chances of something other than a one time hookup.
Instead, assume you want a relationship of some kind with all the women you meet, and if you decide later you don’t want her for that, make that decision at that time. Don’t feel bad about this, because this is exactly what women do to us. Women pretty much always have at least the possibility of a relationship in the back of their minds for all the men they met up with. If they later decide they don’t like you, they ghost your ass and move onto the next prospect.
Since I never do one night stands, I automatically assume the 85/15 frame from the first moment of the first date, with 100% of all first dates I have. I’ve said many times that I want a long-term nonmonogamous relationship with literally every woman I have sex with, ideally one that lasts the rest of my life, even if it’s just an inconsistent FB. This is not an exaggeration and I’m quite serious about this.
The Timing of the Process
One aspect of ensuring that the possibility of a FB or MLTR relationship exists with all the women you meet up with is the timing of when you follow up and meet.
As I’ve discussed in my books, once you have sex with a woman twice (on two separate occasions), you achieve a state of Lock-In where she’ll likely stick around (unless you’ve screwed something up, like going with too much of a player vibe).
However, before you’ve had sex, she can (and often will) vanish/ghost you at any time. Many guys understand this already, but after you’ve had sex one time you’re still in the danger zone. This is when an extra dosage of fear, ASD and buyer’s remorse often kick in, and once again her odds of vanishing/ghosting go up. Once you have sex a second time, only then can you relax and are good to go. At that point, seduction is over and you’re now in the relationship management phase.
Therefore, if FBs and/or MLTRs are your goal and you like to get to sex as quickly as possible, the structure of contact must look like this:
1. First date (if using online dating) or day2 (if using daygame or social circle game). (I have no experience with night game and can’t speak about that.) Ideally around 60 minutes and no more. Sex talk, kino, outcome independent vibe, 85/15 player/provider vibe, no kissing or sexual contact.
2. Follow up the next day, schedule a second date for as soon as possible.
3. Second date at your place, have sex. Make sure she cums or at least feels really good.
4. Follow up the very next day, being very nice, and schedule another meet at your place as soon as humanly possible so you can have sex a second time and achieve Lock-In. The very next day is ideal; as soon as possible otherwise.
5. Third meet, have sex for the second time, make sure she cums (or at least feels really good). Lock-In achieved.
6. Switch out of seduction / dating mode and into relationship management mode. All the usual FB/MLTR relationship rules now begin. Starting seeing her once a week and no more. Only see her more often than once a week once you upgrade her to OLTR (if ever), which should take a minimum of six months of near perfect behavior from her at the MLTR level (and her surviving The Talk).
The point here is that during the phase between the first date and the second lay is not the time to “play it cool” by waiting to contact her. Too many guys do this and lose women. As I’ve talked about often with online dating, time is your enemy. The more time that goes by, the lower your odds of success with her become.
One of the cardinal FB/MLTR rules is that you only see a woman once a week. The problem is guys read this rule and think it applies immediately, as soon as you meet a woman for the first time. No. This rule only applies during the relationship management phase, which only begins after the second time you have sex. Before that, you need to haul ass and make sure things happen as fast as possible.
In the internet age of unlimited sexual options for women, we don’t have the luxury of waiting around on purpose to play it cool without incurring lots of lost lays. Back in the 80s and 90s we could do this and it worked fine. But in a Tinder / Facebook / OKCupid world, that’s not really the case any more.
Sometimes, guys will complain that following up this quickly is “beta” or “needy.” It’s only beta if your frame and verbiage is beta or needy while you’re pitching second and third meets. For example:
Beta: “I had a really great time and I’d love to see you again. Perhaps you’re free on Thursday?”
Terrible. Your frame is weak, submissive, needy, and you’re placing her on a pedestal. Her attraction drops like a stone. However, the problem isn’t that you’re pitching the date. Your problem is you’re pitching the date like a pussy.
Let’s say you did it like this instead:
Alpha: “We should meet up again. I might have Thursday or Friday free.”
Much better. You’re being directive, you’re not kissing her ass, and your frame is strong, but you’re still being polite enough to not scare her or raise ASD.
I have used this exact system, as laid out above, scores of times over many years with extremely high success rates:
1. I get laid fast. My average meet-to-lay time is 3 hours of face time. Often, it’s much less.
2. I get laid cheap. My average, grand total cost-to-lay these days is less than $24. One third of the time it’s zero dollars.
3. 74% of every woman I have sex with turn into an ongoing FB or MLTR relationship. The vast majority if these last a year or longer, making my return on time invested absolutely fantastic as compared to anyone else I know of in the PUA world. This includes women of all ages, races, income levels, and personality types. My average initial relationship length these days is about 1.5 years before the first LSNFTE. Even after that, 94% of women return to me eventually. With LSFNTEs included, most my relationships last 4+ years, often much longer. To this day I still regularly play around with women I first had sex with 7-9 years ago with minimal effort.
This system works. If you want more detail on how to do it, check out my books.