By now, many of you have heard about the Tinder Trap that occurred last week. If you didn’t know, an NYC woman hired a bunch of guys in India to swipe right on thousands of men for a “date.” About 1,000 men actually showed up to this “date.”

She got up on stage with these men and said things like, “If you’re under 5’10”, go home. If you’re a Trump supporter, go home,” and so on. Hundreds of guys left. But! Hundreds of guys actually stayed(!) She then made these guys do pushups and run a race and all kinds of other shit in order to win the opportunity to have a first date with her (not sex with her or anything like that, just a date). And these guys actually did it(!).

I will state for the record that this woman was not in the least attractive. She was very plain and average-looking. I wouldn’t have sex with her.

Out of these 1,000 men, she finally picked a “winner” and they went out on a date. The result? She said there was “no chemistry” and dumped him.

This story is getting a lot of play in manosphere circles, as you might expect.

The problem is that just about everyone talking about this is blaming the woman. Virtually no one is talking about these pussy betas, and if they are, they just mention it in passing and then get right back to insulting the woman.

I don’t blame the woman at all. Is she a bitch? Of course she is. She’s an arrogant liar of the highest order. If someone had wasted my time like this, I would have been upset. This would never have happened to me though, since I would have never swiped right on a woman who looked this average.

And that’s my point. This entire thing would never have been a problem for me. Also I know that this problem would have never been a issue for many of you in this blog’s audience.

That’s because we’re not desperate, thirsty, needy beta male pussies.

I don’t blame her. I blame these fucking men.

She’s simply doing a shitty version of what I recommend men do; if Western civilization is collapsing (and it is) and there’s nothing you can do to stop it (and there isn’t), then instead of sitting around and getting angry about it, exploit it for your personal gain. Granted, she’s doing this in a very dishonest and downright shitty way, but that’s what she’s doing.

What are these fucking men doing? The exact opposite. Some average-looking bitch snaps her fingers and issues orders like a little Hitler, and these fucking pussies snap to attention and say “Yes master!” and do her bidding.

So, who’s the real idiot here? Who’s the real problem here? I’ll give you a hint. It’s not her.

If I’m really pissing you off by saying this, I’m going to ask you a question, and I want you to do your best to clear out the emotions in your brain and answer this question honestly and rationally. Ready? Here goes:

Would this woman have tried this if she was reasonably sure it wouldn’t have worked?

If this woman had known in advance that there was no way in hell that thousands of needy beta males would show up at a park and do pushups and relay races for her, would she have attempted this in the first place?

The answer is no. She would have never done this.

But because men have become such pussies, women know this, and women now pull this kind of shit knowing they can get away with it. If men didn’t put up with this crap, women wouldn’t be doing these things. Therefore, the fault is not with women, but with men.

To be clear, I do not support what this woman did. I’m not on her “side.” She’s a lying, time-wasting bitch. At the same time, I blame men for this bullshit far more than I blame delusional dominant females. These women would have no room to pull this garbage if men were like they used to be in the 1950s and prior.

But because men have chosen to be girly, needy, little pussies (and yes, they have chosen to become this way; no one forced them) average-looking women can now smile, sit back, and snap their fingers and watch with glee as hordes of pathetic betas do their bidding.

Again, who’s being smart here and who’s being stupid?

I’ve also seen a lot of people attack both Tinder and online dating in general for this problem. Wrong. If today’s men weren’t fucking pussies, online dating, and all other forms of dating, would work just fine. But if men insist on being betas, then yeah, all dating, not just online dating, but all dating is going to be a cluster fuck.

The problem isn’t online dating. The problem isn’t Tinder. The problem isn’t bitches. The problem is men. It starts with men. If men stopped putting up with this crap, everything else would fix itself.

Focusing too much blame on this one woman is dangerous, since it gives beta males a pass. The problem didn’t start with this woman or women like her. This is the result of the problem.

The actual problem is men being needy pussies. As long as men insist on being this way, these problems will continue, and get worse.

And they will.

Enjoy the decline!

103 Comments on “In The Dating Marketplace It’s Actually MEN Who Are The Problem

  1. This is indeed totally crazy. Even if you play the game and win the competition, even if your are the “best” among the 1000 men, what will be your EFA during the date? That of a beta male who does anything she wants just to have a first date with her (that he probably paid for). No wonder she felt no “chemistry”.

  2. This is living proof of the so called 80:20 rule about online dating. This is the top 20% of guys (looks,height,perceived wealth & status) will be deemed acceptable and pursued by the top 80% of women. This leaves a race to the bottom where the rest of the guys, the remaining 80% are left realistically chasing the bottom 20% of the women. These below average women get thousands of messages by critically thirsty Beta – Males and perhaps understandably assume they are sex goddesses! The unfortunate reality and result for these women if they decide one of these guys is worthy of a date is getting “pumped and dumped” and spending the rest of her life stating NO ONE NIGHT STAND OR HOOK UPS in her profile.   However at the other end of the spectrum the top 20% of guys have the pick of the cream never need to commit and the top 80% of the women spend the rest of their lives (with their cats) moaning about where have all the good men gone! My cynical view granted but as BD says the West is free falling to some sort of social Armageddon. Stay frosty y’all.

  3. I just smirked when I read this article.  It makes me more committed as an alpha to not bend and make her work for me . .

  4. @ Blackdragon

    I say to you, “Amen!!!” I am  little more forgiving of men than you are but overwhelmingly support what you have said in this article. I will explain as best as I can below.

    First and most importantly, men have Obsolete Biological Wiring, OBW, to support women from prehistoric times because without that support of provisioning and protection, women would live more miserable lives and die sooner and in greater numbers without it due to their relative physical weaknesses in comparison to men on average which is only compounded by being impregnated and having to look after small children as well as nurse them with human and women’s breastmilk, in my opinion. Our species could not go on without the impregnation of women and the raising of children to replace us.

    Social Programing, SP, is the second problem which compounds the OBW to the 3rd degree and more. We men have had the brainwashing and indoctrination of SP to think that women’s love especially romantic love is equal to and greater than our own love especially romantic love when the opposite is true. Rationally look at this. If there is no greater love than to lay down one’s life for another human being then men on average have been doing this for women in by far greater numbers and percentages than women have for men since prehistoric times. Men need to believe that their love especially romantic love is greater than and has a higher value than women’s love especially romantic love. Prostitution prohibition needs to be eliminated as well as prostitution needs to be legalized and better yet decriminalized. Men should learn about Hypergamy, GAME and seduction skills, yet it should be recognized that some men will learn and perform much better than others and that some men will have a better aptitude for learning and performing in the SMP than others especially the fact that some men will have a lower aptitude to learn and perform well in the SMP no matter how hard and smart they try while other men who have a better aptitude will learn and perform better despite being stupid and lazy. Sexbots can not come fast enough too. It was not a good idea to give the women the right to vote especially if they are not subject to military service like men are because women vote for tyranny and more government more than men and this is especially true when it comes to male sexual freedom. Prostitution Prohibition came in around the same time men have women the right to vote as an example of tyranny being imposed Once a man realized that his love is worth more than a woman’s love especially when it comes to romantic love and he can easily and affordably access sex from women prostitutes or sex-robots,  then a lot of this nonsense as described in the article will end. men should always remember that women need us more than we need them, as well as women have more solipsistic and parasitic tendencies than men on average.

    Let us look at the historical record. The decline set in in the 1100sAD when the Troubadours started the Age of Romance. men simply did not think nor feel about women the same way in the 900sAD and before as in  the 1300sAD and after as the Dalrock blog and the famous author C.S. Lewis have noted because before this time women had to prove themselves worthy to marry men and to be worthy of the love of men where after this men had to prove their love to women. and be worthy of marriage.. Both Dalrock and Lewis have noted that this is the biggest revolutionary change ever in human history especially when it comes to how men related to women in the SMP. Increasing numbers of annulments happened within marriage among the elite if not the commoners from the 1100sAD. the divorce remerged in the 1500 with the Protestant revolt in the West. Then the late 18th century and early 19th century Age of Romance emerged producing the idea that men were natural scoundrels and women were holy pure people by nature. This led to divorce favoring women in the 19th century and later where women got the home and children increasingly from the 19th century on whereas before men got the home and children and women got shown the door from the 18th century and earlier. then men allowed women the vote in the early 20th century and not even have to serve in the military(except Israel which means the Israelis are committing less of a mistake than the rest of the West even though they are still committing a mistake) Then we got no fault divorce from the 1960s on. As you can see men have been socially programming themselves and even worse their succeeding generations of men(sons and grandsons as well as nephews and grandnephews) to be bigger pussies since the 1100s. That process has accelerated rapidly since the beginning of the 20th century.

    Feel free to ignore this if you are limited in time, but it would behoove you to read this paragraph. The 1950s were the last of a sane decade and century in which was decent for most men in the Sexual Market Place, SMP. It has rapidly gotten worse each decade from the 1960s on. However, the SMP has slowly gotten worse from the 1100s on. Each century saw a decline in the SMP for men and a betterment for women which accelerated each century even more. Now it is accelerating each decade faster and faster. Yes men now are on average bigger physical, mental and emotional pussies now on average than men of the 1950sAD, and the same could be said of  men of the 1950sAD being bigger, physical, mental and emotional pussies than the men of the 1850sAD, and of men being bigger physical, mental and emotional pussies than the men of the 1750sAD, and men of the 1750sAD were bigger physical, mental and emotional pussies than men of the 1450sAD, and of men being bigger pussies than men of the 1250sAD, and finally of men f the 1250s being bigger physical, mental and emotional pussies than men of the 950sAD in Indigenous European cultures in particular.

     

  5. This is hilarious (well, maybe not for the men involved).

     

    First of, I don’t think she’s that plain looking, but I know BD is more in to blondes. Where as I, being raised in a town where many women could star in the show Vikings, sometimes prefer more Italian of Latino looking women.

    However, charm and personality is also very important to me and she’s sorely lacking in that department. Downright annoying she is.

     

    10-15 years ago I probably also would have been one of the chumps jumping through hoops for her bizarre statement. Now, part in thanks to BD’s Unchained Man book (and similar content) I almost never waste time on this kind of behavior. To many great women to meet or to much great stuff to do.

    This really shows that men in the West on average need a confidence booster.

  6. Its just an extreme version of the very common the guy paid for her dinner and then she dumps him and then he complains about it… well why did he pay for her dinner if they didn’t even have sex?! Problem is this is very common and its very rare that someone responds to it with the simple answer I just gave…

    But if you say the problem is the men then do you have a solution? Not for the society of course but for example how this can be exploiter but those few normal of us left?

    Its true totally that it pays to be selective. I learned that the hard way.

  7. Saw the news report on YouTube.  The bitch is very annoying, maybe a 6.9?  No way in hell I take any shit from that, easy to next.

    What’s really pathetic is the gathering of 1000 beta bitches and obeyed her every command.  That is one sad sight to see.

     

     

  8. I thought based on the title that you would focus on shitting on the men who signed up for this “date competition” nonsense, but you completely missed the opportunity to shit on one particular man: The guy who created the entire stunt.

    Yes, the real mastermind behind this whole thing was actually a man. It was all a marketing stunt by “Rob Bliss Creative.”

    https://nypost.com/2018/08/20/mass-tinder-date-was-actually-a-marketing-stunt/

    In fact, a lot of the bullshit that you blame the woman for in this article was actually his idea. He’s the douche in this video that explains everything: 

    The video explains that the whole point is to call attention to how online dating is “messed up” and “shallow” (something that you have debunked before). But of course the “valuable lesson” got completely drowned out while this guy probably took home a ton of viral marketing cash.

  9. Even if you play the game and win the competition, even if your are the “best” among the 1000 men, what will be your EFA during the date?

    Exactly. But these dumbasses are so desperate they don’t care.

    This is the top 20% of guys (looks,height,perceived wealth & status) will be deemed acceptable and pursued by the top 80% of women. This leaves a race to the bottom where the rest of the guys, the remaining 80% are left realistically chasing the bottom 20% of the women.

    The point is, even if that’s true, any man reading these words (unless he’s physically deformed or something) can make the decision to move into that 20% whenever he wants with a little effort. It’s not an excuse.

    Doclove- your comment was too long for me to read.

    First of, I don’t think she’s that plain looking, but I know BD is more in to blondes.

    One of my FBs is Mexican so I ‘m into everything.

    Everyone’s opinion is different, but the point is this woman is not hot. If she was super, ultra hot, then you might be able to come up with a rational explanation as to why these men behaved this way. But she wasn’t.

    But if you say the problem is the men then do you have a solution?

    Yep. The solution is to read my book and follow its instructions even if it’s temporarily uncomfortable to do so.

    90% of men won’t do this though, as I’ve said many times.

  10. Lol. I read that article that was linked, and it said that a guy was actually behind everything. He paid that girl and those other people that helped with the mass swiping as part of movie he was filming.

    It was an attack on men being too superficial, even though the article kept stating “people.” So this competition was meant as a way to give men a taste of their own medicine so to speak. Poor women are objectified and subjected to men’s “impossible” standards of beauty. They should be willing to get with ex carousel riders, single moms and fatties who are beautiful on the inside. They need to accept any scraps that get thrown at them and consider themselves lucky!

  11. you completely missed the opportunity to shit on one particular man: The guy who created the entire stunt.

      Again I will repeat: Would this guy have even attempted this if he knew it wouldn’t have worked?

    No, the problem is MEN, not this one individual man.

  12. I saw this when it originally popped up on Twitter, it was from the perspective of one of the “victims” and his original portrayal was something like “I was surprised someone so attractive matched and was actually talking to me.” Normal looking dude.

    At least he had the self respect to leave once she announced it (although not smart enough to NOT post about it on Twitter next to his face).

    I honestly can’t comprehend how most of the men I run into in the world function.

  13. All the 1,000 men who showed up for this “date” broke a cardinal dating rule;

    As a man, you set the date (venue, time, day) at your convenience. Never let a woman set the date, never meet a woman for a date on her own terms.

    Break this rule and bad things like this will happen to you.

  14. I saw this when it originally popped up on Twitter, it was from the perspective of one of the “victims” and his original portrayal was something like “I was surprised someone so attractive matched and was actually talking to me.” Normal looking dude.
    At least he had the self respect to leave once she announced it (although not smart enough to NOT post about it on Twitter next to his face).
    I honestly can’t comprehend how most of the men I run into in the world function.

    Yes, I saw that Twitter thread too. But look at the pictures she put up on Tinder : she looks way hotter in them than she does in real life (this unfortunately happens a lot).

    I immediately thought about you BD when I saw the article haha! The guys would need to read your books, and your article about how you do not do “activity” dates. Something that I learned a long time ago, and that everyone who does online dating should keep in mind : always do the date on your terms, and never ever “meet up” with a girl somewhere she suggests, as girls are experts at doing their own little “Tinder traps” : like telling you to come to a party where she knows will be a few other guys who are into her.

    Guys that I know mess that up soooo much. Just having the girl come to you is already a step in the right direction in terms of frame.

  15. The Ariana Grande thing has also made manosphere faggots butthurt and mad. She CLEARLY did not want that pastor or whatever to grope her as she backed off and looked disgusted, but he went on and groped her like a thirsty prick anyways.

    And now the manosphere (particularly incels, I have a theory that most of the manosphere are incels actually) are raging about this, saying stuff like “ZOMG its going to be illegal to flirt with chicks soon!!!” As documented in this video:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YZkeNOSCtFc

    Omegas, betas, and most alpha 1s need to quit acting like chicks. It’s getting annoying seeing all this stupid outrage. It’s not even funny anymore.

  16. I have always felt that men are most of the problem.

    While I can forgive a man being blue pill back in the 90s, after the end of 2015, there are so many ways to find out the truth with so much cumulative androsphere content out there, that men who are still blue pill have actually made a conscious decision to avoid the truth.  They deserve to be harvested.  The typical blue-pill beta is quite happy to spend $300 on a 6 who ends up not having sex with him.  They rinse and repeat again.

    At the voting level, male blue-pilledness is why our entire government and economy have become a massive wealth-transfer scheme from men to women.

  17. I told everyone these dating apps are made for the benefit of women: Bumbler, Tinder, whatever the worthless sh*t they’re called. Women and their beta admirers. Have fun in femdom kingdom, boys !

  18. The thing is, as BD points out, due to female hypergamy, a man really just has to get into the top 20% or top 25% for the world to become an entirely different place.

    As long as a man is average in looks, career, style, voice tonality, Game can move him from ‘average’ to ‘Top 20%’.  This is much harder if the man comes from an unwanted race (Chinese, Indian, etc.), but not impossible.

    What is more interesting is that VR Sex will be available pretty soon, which will turn this whole thing upside down yet again.

     

  19. I immediately said the same thing! THE MEN ARE COMPLETELY AT FAULT I was simultaneously laughing, annoyed and embarrassed for my species. Not only have they all got themselves ready, dressed up and traveled there… They’ve allowed themselves to be dismissed and then competing with each other like a load of chickens over a solitary piece of corn.

    What the fuck.. what should have happened is that one guy with some actual balls should have stood on a box and shouted ‘let us all get the fuck out of here and try and pick up some women’.

  20. So ~1000 guys came and ~100 of them played her silly game, while many stayed for the lulz.

    But I can feel even a greater number of guys thinking “No way I stand a chance, I’m inferior to these 100 men in every regard, I’m unworthy of even a passing glance by this angel” skulking into a corner. Same for a sizable chunk of those 1,300 matches that accepted the invitation but failed to appear before even learning of the trap.

    More chances for me, yay. But so pathetic.

  21. I told everyone these dating apps are made for the benefit of women: Bumbler, Tinder, whatever the worthless sh*t they’re called. Women and their beta admirers. Have fun in femdom kingdom, boys !

    If you can pull pussy from these apps, who the fuck cares about the reasons why they were created and for whom?

  22. While I can forgive a man being blue pill back in the 90s, after the end of 2015, there are so many ways to find out the truth with so much cumulative androsphere content out there, that men who are still blue pill have actually made a conscious decision to avoid the truth.

    Correct. I’ve said the same thing. There are no excuses for this behavior anymore, not in the internet age.

    More chances for me, yay. But so pathetic.

    That’s exactly my view.

  23. The thing is, as BD points out, due to female hypergamy, a man really just has to get into the top 20% or top 25% for the world to become an entirely different place.

    As long as a man is average in looks, career, style, voice tonality, Game can move him from ‘average’ to ‘Top 20%’.  This is much harder if the man comes from an unwanted race (Chinese, Indian, etc.), but not impossible.

    What is more interesting is that VR Sex will be available pretty soon, which will turn this whole thing upside down yet again.  This could be under two years away (VR Sex trumps Sexbots, btw).

     

  24. If you’re a Trump supporter, go home,”

    Well, there you go. All the alpha males went home. All she had left were a bunch of skinny, limp wristed, friend-zone dwelling Bernie bros and “I’m with her” pussy virgins.

    No wonder they stayed and performed for her. And she had no chemistry with the beta she picked. Duh!

     

     

  25. Yes, Blackdragon, tell us more about how pointy her elbows are

    Her face is thoroughly unattractive, including in that picture. I personally would not have sex with her.

    Just because a woman has a flat stomach doesn’t mean she’s hot, at least in my view. More than that is required. For example, my women have flat stomachs and hot faces.

    But hey, if you think her face is smoking hot, that’s great and that’s your opinion. And I have mine. As I’ve said many times, attraction is subjective.

    For the record, how many girls are you fucking on the regular that are more attractive than her?

    Three. Pink Firefly and my two primary FBs are far more hot than that chick, in that they have fit, trim bodies and very attractive faces. PF and one of my FBs most men would consider model-quality. I’ve shown pics of my active women at many of my seminars and attendees usually agree.

    I can’t show you pics of my FBs at the moment (though I’d love to brag). Pics of PF are coming at some point, maybe later this year.

    Again I will repeat that all of this is highly subjective and not all men will agree with my assessment, or yours, regarding all kinds of women.

    All she had left were a bunch of skinny, limp wristed, friend-zone dwelling Bernie bros and “I’m with her” pussy virgins.

    She’s clearly a Dominant so that’s what she wanted. If that chick actually went out on a first date with a real Alpha Male (1.0 or 2.0) she’d be thoroughly disgusted within 10 minutes.

  26. If she was super, ultra hot, then you might be able to come up with a rational explanation as to why these men behaved this way. But she wasn’t.

    Can we just stop discussing her appearance? We could as well say that the 100 guys that chose to participate were ones whose “type” she was, so for them she could have actually been super hot.

    In The Dating Marketplace It’s Actually MEN Who Are The Problem

    BD, could you please clarify whose problem they are?

    If the headline is synonymous to “Most Men Have No Clue What’s Attractive To Women”… well… what a sensation.

  27. Can we just stop discussing her appearance?

    No. It’s my blog and I’ll talk about whatever I like.

    We could as well say that the 100 guys that chose to participate were ones whose “type” she was, so for them she could have actually been super hot.

    What are the odds of that?

    BD, could you please clarify whose problem they are?

    1. They are their own problem, because they don’t get the sex / companionship they desperately want.

    2. They are our problem, because they raise the bar to entry for all other men because of this stupid behavior. Read this.

  28. Good fucking god. I haven’t heard any of this (I don’t ever read news or manosphere stuff), and I’m quite glad. This is so ridiculous! Are these men just not getting laid at all? Do they not know how? I just don’t get it…

  29. Dear Blackdragon,

    I wonder why you have not mentioned the pretty obvious problem here:

    The men came there NOT because they considered her attractive, but because they considered her a realistic prospect.

    Men, especially Betas, are scavenger opportunists. If she was super, smoking-hot model with godlike body and angelic face, most men would NOT BOTHER, as they would reasonably conclude that this is a setup.

    But she was ugly enough for it to be believable that she might want to meet an average guy.

    I see Betas (and myself in the past) do this mistake all the time. We go after average/plain women below our desires, because we conclude it will be easier, or that they would be less demanding, or more likely to find us attractive…. but this is not the case. 6s are as hard to game as 9s, just a bit different.

  30. “Yes, Blackdragon, tell us more about how pointy her elbows are: https://www.instagram.com/p/BkDLGqzABwe/?hl=en&taken-by=natashavaponte
    For the record, how many girls are you fucking on the regular that are more attractive than her?”

    Second this – she’s definitely in 7 range looking at her instagram pics. Maybe you rate yourself too highly BD? I’m too curious about what women you pull from online dating, and if they often have issues (drugs, young single mom, poor immigrant from 3rd world country etc).

    Male looks levels:
    9-10 Very chiseled, handsome face (Henry Cavil, top male models)

    8 Handsome men, leading alpha male characters in Hollywood (eg Hemsworth bros)

    7 pretty boy (Gosling, Paul Walker)

    6 upper end average, no obvious flaws, not fat, good hairline, but no strong handsome masculine features

    5 average

    4 below average (overweight, balding etc, but no major flaws)

    Most men are in 4-6 range. How do you rate yourself?

    DJ

  31. And now some “beta as fuck” point of view.

    Now that I read BD for half an year it’s easy for me to say “I would never do that!”

    6 months ago … I Just don’t know. I hadn’t been thunderstruck on the road to Damascus yet!

    These guys acted like this because they believe men (not women) must display value on women terms. I believe DocLove has already elaborated thouroughly on the romantic ideology behind that. Add the societal pressure of having 100 dudes acting the same (betas follow the herd!) … and you’re good to go. It’s adamantely stupid but I bet you could find more than a couple of guys in the crowd that stood there … just because!

    I have nothing to do with BD nor know the guy and won’t ever match blue suits with red shirts … but yes, these guys need desperately some of his medecine! Once you know you are in a prison because you accepted to believe that 2+2=5 you’ll start fighting it … no matter how shallow and useless that fight gets!

    PS: I also think that looks have nothing to do with it, since they are subjective. Would you BD start to run around like an hamster if the girl was Sophia Vergara?

     

     

  32. The girl was most likely click-baiting, maybe trying to prove a point, not actually meet a guy. Recently I read on Tom Torero’s blog that feminism is just a giant, society-wide shit test, or frame test. The more I think of it, the more I think it’s true. Women have been wired to lust for the tribe leaders and the sharp hunters, and this longing hasn’t gone anywhere. With the false belief that society is going to provide for everyone, most men have gone astray from these types. So behind this girl’s acting like “Yeehaa, we women have all the power now”, I’m sure I can hear her thinking “Uh yeah we do have all the power. Can you guys not GROW A SPINE ?!”

  33. The men came there NOT because they considered her attractive, but because they considered her a realistic prospect.

    Men, especially Betas, are scavenger opportunists. If she was super, smoking-hot model with godlike body and angelic face, most men would NOT BOTHER, as they would reasonably conclude that this is a setup.

    Very good point. I hadn’t considered that.

    Second this – she’s definitely in 7 range looking at her instagram pics

    That’s perfectly fine. It’s all subjective. I’m sure there are other men who rate her an 8 or higher. For example, I think Jessica Biel is hideous as fuck, but there are many men who would rate her a 10. It’s all good.

    I’m too curious about what women you pull from online dating, and if they often have issues (drugs, young single mom, poor immigrant from 3rd world country etc).

    None of those things bother me. They’re great for FBs.

    Most men are in 4-6 range. How do you rate yourself?

    I’m reasonably handsome as compared to the average 46 year-old American man, but that’s not difficult. (Get the upcoming video course and you can see exactly how I look.) As compared to a Hollywood hunk I’m ugly as fuck since I’m overweight, but it’s irrelevant. If you think physical attractiveness is the determining factor as to whether or not a man gets laid with hot chicks, you have a lot to learn about how women work.

    I am confident, outcome independent, 46 year-old, high-income Alpha Male with 12 years of consistent PUA/dating/seduction experience. Yes, the woman I have sex with on a regular basis today are very hot. If anyone actually finds that difficult to believe, then your brain works in strange ways, but feel free to think whatever you like.

    Would you BD start to run around like an hamster if the girl was Sophia Vergara?

    No. A) I already have attrctive women in my sex life and B) I can get new attractive women whenever I want without running relay races with other men.

    That’s the entire point of this article.

  34. They say she got 7k Matches on just tinder app. Can any Man even get even half that amount of matches in any city in any country with all dating apps combined and include social media response messsages instragam, facebook etc as well? lol

  35. Yes, Blackdragon, tell us more about how pointy her elbows are: https://www.instagram.com/p/BkDLGqzABwe/?hl=en&taken-by=natashavaponte

    For the record, how many girls are you fucking on the regular that are more attractive than her?

    Her name is Natasha, and that probably sounds potentially Russian.  BD doesn’t mess with Russians.  But I’ll agree with your sarcasm a little.  When I saw her, I immediately thought “I’d bang her”.  I wouldn’t play her bullshit though.  I also live in a low-populated area, so I know that automatically has lowered my standards a bit.

  36. 2. They are our problem, because they raise the bar to entry for all other men because of this stupid behavior. Read this.

    I must be feeling like arguing with BD, so here goes?

    I’m pretty sure someone else acting like a thirsty sap is not my problem, since I can’t do anything about someone else behavior.

    Further, I’m not convinced acting like an outcome independent man who neither gives nor tolerates shit is any edge.  I almost don’t care.  This is how I wanna live my life, and if its not for you, cya later!

    I quit worrying about things I couldn’t control about 10 years ago.  I don’t have enough time or energy to waste on what thirsty saps do or think.

     

     

  37. Societal programming is indeed a very strong thing. Its sad that SP has made so many people misinterpret how society works so much that: 1. So many men think they need to go that far into beta behavior to successfully get a girl (when abundant evidence point otherwise), and 2. Girls actually think they will find someone theyre genuinely attracted in such a travesty of a least masculine man competition (when abundant evidence shows otherwise).

    Everyone knows a guy that gets all the girls. Everybody knows that guy would never go that far

    Every girl has guys that they got crushes on. They all know that the people she knows that would go through this humilliation are deep on their friendzone, not their crushes

  38. It doesn’t matter if BD thought she was homely.

    Are you saying if she was a 10/10 model you would have gladly showed up, wasted your time, and done push-ups for a chance at smashing pissers with her?

    As someone else mentioned here — NEVER let the woman set the meeting place. Timing you can be more flexible – people are busy. But at least until you bed here, don’t let her run the show.

    Let’s face facts. This 10/10 could have easily duped you until coming out. And even if you left immediately, your TIME was still WASTED.

    I’ve learned a few things over the years. Girls who are overly involved with being the one who set the meeting place, they won’t budge on it? 1. SCAMMERS. This chick above constitutes a scammer. RUN. 2. Some crazy feminist agenda, or is just not that into you — if the girl is into you, she will be at least somewhat submissive in some areas including this one. Probably of time waster/ nut is too high.

    When I was in Russia where most girls where super thirsty to fuck, they would always agree to whatever place I wanted (unless they didn’t drink alcohol, then they’d make ME pick something else) … many would drive over an hour. The rare 3% that were adamant about going to XYZ bar? Scammer, promoter, some kind of criminal ruse. If a girl legit wants to have sex you, she DOES NOT care about an exact date location. Why would she? If she’s trying to set you up, she wants to be running the show, picking the place.

    This should be true in most all aspects of life. Pause. Think. Reflect. Are YOU running the show? Are YOU determining the places you’re going? The choices you’re making?

    Or is someone else “guiding” you to a certain path? Or choice? Or decision? …. More often than not, that indicates you’re being manipulated. It means you’re about to get fucked up the ass.

  39. If you know anything about the sexual imperatives of men and women you will know 2 things

    1) Such a competition will only result in her getting a date with a beta male so it’s guaranteed that there would be no chemistry

    2) The main reason she did it in the first place was not to find a guy. It was to indulge her own narcissism.

     

     

  40. She seems to have a nice, skinny body but creative camera angles, lighting and makeup for Instagram cover up her doughy face and big nose. The media images in public are less forgiving but still she is in the 6-7 range.

    The ironic/satirical thing is that the srlf-proclaimed purpose of this was to illustrate how people are overly picky when judging people for online dating.

    There is still hope for men as a group.  She and Bliss outsourced help to swipe right on basically every guy on tinder.  I don’t know how many that is but she got 7500 matches that were messaged.  Of those, 2300 said they would show (we don’t know how many didn’t respond at all).  Of those, 1000 showed up, and of those about 100 remained for the festivities.

    So, 90% bailed when they realuzed it was a sham.  Less than 5% of those who said they would be there ended up being part of the Thirsy Games. Of those who were messages, only 1-in-75 – 1.33% – let themselves be run through the ringer.

    BD keeps spreadsheets of his response rates and other statistics.  I’m not sure if there is a direct analogy to be drawn here but BD can tell us how many girls he has slept with based on the number of openers he has sent.  Probably more than 1.33%

    What can’t be claimed is that this phenomenon isn’t a personal problem because the chick in question isn’t hot enough and at the same time claiming that attraction/looks are completely subjective. If it’s not a personal problem it must be on some other basis, and if the guys are to blame it must be on some other basis than their thirst being irrational because some third party thinks the chick isn’t hot.

  41. Recently I read on Tom Torero’s blog that feminism is just a giant, society-wide shit test, or frame test. The more I think of it, the more I think it’s true.

    That’s literally all it ever was and all it will ever be. Anyone who gets butthurt about it is a losing player. And the ones who are stupid enough to actually do activism against it? Well they’re pretty much just as bad as the feminists.

  42. I’m pretty sure someone else acting like a thirsty sap is not my problem, since I can’t do anything about someone else behavior.

    I have no idea if it’s a problem for you as an individual. When I said “our” I meant men in general.

    Go try to fuck an over-33 woman via online dating on the second date, and you’ll quickly see why beta behavior is a real problem. (If you never want women over age 33, or don’t mind waiting a longer time for sex, then I suppose it’s not a problem for you individually.)

    I’m not convinced acting like an outcome independent man who neither gives nor tolerates shit is any edge.

    I’m not sure what you mean. Outcome Independence is a huge factor in sexual attraction; one of the biggest there is.

  43. So, 90% bailed when they realuzed it was a sham.  Less than 5% of those who said they would be there ended up being part of the Thirsy Games. Of those who were messages, only 1-in-75 – 1.33% – let themselves be run through the ringer.

    Valid point.

  44. I’m not sure what you mean. Outcome Independence is a huge factor in sexual attraction; one of the biggest there is.

    I remain unconvinced; but that doesn’t matter.  Even if it’s not an edge, it’s the right thing to do.

    I concur about 33+ women and online dating, however, I don’t think it’s because of thirsty betas.  Long ago  I chalked it up to something biological.  Remember how bitchy and uncooperative your mom (and your friends moms) were when you were in high school?  Here’s a clue – they were all over 33.  That’s just how women are at 33+!  Raging ASD, super bitchy, entitled.

    Even if you disagree with me on the WHY (to me, blaming betas is a convienent buffer), it doesn’t matter because the THATS HOW IT IS doesn’t change and we don’t disagree.

  45. It’s not the individual that’s the problem but the collective, meaning the ‘Government’ who controls and manipulates how society runs… They’re to blame!

    If they really wanted to, they could change things around with a flick of a finger, but as it isn’t happening nor is it ever likely to happen. The only solution a man has is to leave the country.

  46. This is the top 20% of guys (looks,height,perceived wealth & status) will be deemed acceptable and pursued by the top 80% of women. This leaves a race to the bottom where the rest of the guys, the remaining 80% are left realistically chasing the bottom 20% of the women.

     

    Oh, come one, this is the same with men. Have a look at all the women you met today, either in real life or, say, on Tinder (and I mean all of them, not only those in your favorite age range) : do you really think more than one out of five is desirable?

    What’s important is not what they want, but what they can get. The top 20% of male fuck like crazy, sure, but they certainly don’t want to fuck all those “top” 80% : why would they fuck those below average 4s or 5s when they have more than enough 9s and 10s?

  47. The last two posts are 100% buffer and nonsense.

    Organizations are made perfectly to get the performance they achieve.  This is true for individuals too. You are failing because of YOU.

    Dont feel too bad, you are most people would rather pat themselves on back with some made up excuse rather than look in the mirror and fix the problem.  Which, inevetiblly, is them.

    And I challenge you – is that the life you want?  One of excuses because the government has you down, or because you mentally don’t see yourself in the top 20%?

    Youve psyched yourself out with this ” scarcity mentality” , and just gave up before you’ve even left the gate!  Why do that to yourself?  Is your ego that fragile?

  48. Never let a woman set the date, never meet a woman for a date on her own terms.

    BD, is that your position as well?

  49. She’s cute, I’d fuck her..  I think that was a publicity stunt but here’s the thing..  those men are marriage material..  compliant men who will carry your purse and pick up your pads at wallmart..  men shouldn’t be that compliant until they’re In their 70’s.

  50. The only solution a man has is to leave the country.

    Already in the works. PF and I are looking at houses in Oceania in March. 🙂

    Never let a woman set the date, never meet a woman for a date on her own terms.

    BD, is that your position as well?

    Just about. You should set the agenda to make sure the odds for fast sex are highest. If she suggests anything outside of this (“Lets get dinner instead”) or something fishy (“Lets meet in a parking lot”), then you need to nicely say no and re-direct back to your own suggestion, and move on if she’s adamant.

    However, on the off chance that she suggests something within the system, like she suggests a particular Starbucks to grab a coffee, that’s fine. It won’t happen very often but it does happen, and I’ve had fast sex with women who did it.

  51. BD, I believe you’re looking at this the wrong way. This is AWESOME! I say this as an admitted alpha 1.0. Western Society, as you say, is dying. It will collapse. Men being pussies is a huge reason. Again, as you state, I can’t save society but I can sure take advantage of the decline. The more men who are beta pussies, the better for me. When I was actively dating, I learned that even though I was a pretty average looking middle-aged guy, I could get lots of hot pussy simply by being my alpha self, not suppressing my inner cocky dick. It seemed contradictory at the time, but made sense as I learned.  Also, I learned that it wasn’t any more difficult to bed a hot girl than a average looking girl. They all had hordes of men seeking their attention. So, why not go after the hottest women? It worked like a charm.  Fuck these beta pussy wimps. Let them suffer. Let them fight over bitchy, average looking women. I’m all for it! The more, the merrier.

  52. I wonder how much of this is due to the government passing coercive laws banning prostitution.  I doubt that many native European men with a job that pays a decent salary, who can legally sleep with a 8 or 9 for $20, would put up with this nonsense.

    Then again the overwhelming majority of guys didn’t participate in this farce.  So maybe many of the guys who stayed to compete were natural submissives that enjoy being publicly humiliated by women.  It would make sense since the competitors were a self selecting group.

  53. BD, I believe you’re looking at this the wrong way. This is AWESOME! I say this as an admitted alpha 1.0. Western Society, as you say, is dying. It will collapse. Men being pussies is a huge reason. Again, as you state, I can’t save society but I can sure take advantage of the decline. The more men who are beta pussies, the better for me.

    Not sure why you think I’m looking at this the wrong way when what you stated is exactly my view.

    I wonder how much of this is due to the government passing coercive laws banning prostitution.  I doubt that many native European men with a job that pays a decent salary, who can legally sleep with a 8 or 9 for $20, would put up with this nonsense.

    I think that’s more or less correct. This is one of the many reasons why prostitution will never become legal in the USA. It’s the one issue where left-wing women and right-wing men agree, as I talked about here.

  54. Alpha Male with 12 years of consistent PUA/dating/seduction experience.

    As I’m sure you’re aware, there is information in some of your other other blog posts and books that doesn’t reflect this precise number of years, especially if accounting for when you actually became proficient at this stuff. Just a heads up; it doesn’t bother me, but there are some nitpickers out there, including many who could be potential customers. Even though you could easily argue that you don’t want these types of customers anyway. Probably two percent stuff, but nevertheless something you might want to keep an eye on.

  55. As I’m sure you’re aware, there is information in some of your other other blog posts and books that doesn’t reflect this precise number of years

    Okay, for the nitpickers, it’s 11.6 years instead of 12. February 2007 to September 2018.

    So to repeat for the nitpickers:

    I am confident, outcome independent, 46 year-old, high-income Alpha Male with 11.6 years of consistent PUA/dating/seduction experience. Yes, the woman I have sex with on a regular basis today are very hot. If anyone actually finds that difficult to believe, then your brain works in strange ways, but feel free to think whatever you like.

  56. …I’m ugly as fuck since I’m overweight, but it’s irrelevant. If you think physical attractiveness is the determining factor as to whether or not a man gets laid with hot chicks, you have a lot to learn about how women work.

    What’s the most important thing you look for in a woman? Let me guess – looks?

    Cost of sex / pregnancy is much bigger for women than men – you think looks (genetic/health indicators) don’t matter to women as much? Women are not visual, they are virtuous angels? Societal programming BD you should know better

     

  57. I doubt that many native European men with a job that pays a decent salary, who can legally sleep with a 8 or 9 for $20

    I don’t know which European countries you’re talking about, but in multiple western european ones right now (1) it’s more like $100-$300 unless you’re going for ugly ones, and (2) it’s actually illegal for the man/client (though not for the escort), per the nordic model, which is spreading.

    That being said, if you accept that risk then yeah, knowing you can go that route say once or twice per month (it helps break dry spells) makes you more relaxed when it comes to dating.

  58. It’s really funny that this can go on..

    If a Man was to do this he’d be Crucified.

    Hell Henry Cavil innocently said he was scared to date in the #MeToo era and he was ripped a new by everybody for that bullshit. Literally exactly the problem he was addressing they did to him LOL.

    The thing is the Women who are on our side like the Sex Positive Feminists and Libertarian/Individualist Feminists (who are really have a lot in common with Alpha 2.0’s IMO) and some other bad ass women who would look at this and think “What a Bitch”  or “What a Cunt” will say nothing because they know better than to because they’ll be Crucified like Henry Cavil was. Lindsey Lohan was just the other day for speaking against #MeToo. Most of the women who have our backs have “MGTOW’d” in their own sort of way from other women and just don’t give a fuck (much like us here).

    So not only will I Agree with Caleb that Men are the problem.. I will also add that that if you think it’s going to get any better.. IT ISN’T and all of our Female Allies or Shield Maidens as I call them.. have given up trying to speak against it because it’s a waste of time and if they’re in Public Fife they can’t risk their careers like that (we can’t expect them too). So we are on our own in this..

  59. I am still waiting for men starting to post #metoo when they have a shitty date who wasted their time or when a girl refused sex. But I guess men are too pussy to do that. And the ones who arent have better things to do… still would be hilarious to see.

  60. This story is a total nothing burger.

    As a few other commenters have pointed out, this whole stunt was put on by a *guy*. The girl was just a hired actor to play a part. OK, I’m sure she got a ton of attention-validation from seeing all the guys show up for their “date” with her, but let’s not forget who was really behind this….to prove that Tinder…. Well, to prove what? The guys saw a fairly attractive (to varying degrees depending on individual taste) girl who responded to them and agreed to set up a face-to-face meet. Big deal. Where’s the terrible, awful, dehumanizing shallowness in that? Pretty much SOP for the modern, connected world, isn’t it? 

    OK sure, Tinder is a dating app that matches based entirely on the *appearance* of the people on it. But when has it ever promised to be anything more? The practical reality is human beings have to find their romantic partner physically attractive. That’s just a base, a starting point. Any sort of meaningful relationship needs more, but if the sight of the person is repellant to you – kinda hard to build a deep, abiding love, no? So you start with liking the look of the person, move to meeting in person to find out about his/her personality, and move from there. Isn’t that how any relationship of any degree of depth starts out?

    And yes, what we as individuals find attractive is probably the result of SP…..and experiences in our early adolescence that determine our favorite “type.” That’s just the way it is. However  you arrive at your preferred “type”, you can’t change it. So stamping the feminist societal foot and petulantly demanding, “Hey guys, you gotta find *this* type of person attractive or else.” Well, it’s not going to work, is it?

    BTW, a properly outcome independent reaction from the guys who got tricked into showing up – via very plausible means – should have been, “Oh ha-ha, that’s funny. Whatever. I’m gonna go get some ice cream.” Then while enjoying your two-scoop cone, text out to your FBs to see if any of them are free to get together, or call up your MLTR and say, “Hey, I’m down at Times Square. How ’bout you catch the crosstown bus and we take in a movie?”

  61. Hey BD,

    Some stats on men who are not having sex in this recent (May 2018) article: https://ifstudies.org/blog/male-sexlessness-is-rising-but-not-for-the-reasons-incels-claim

    With some extra thoughts from the author: https://twitter.com/lymanstoneky/status/992104190989209600

  62. Some stats on men who are not having sex in this recent (May 2018) article

    Wow, fantastic article! I will do a blog post on it.

  63. >If this woman had known in advance that there was no way in hell that thousands of needy beta males would show up at a park

    BD, the only part of this that is acceptable (to me) is the turning up and only the turning up. A guy who agrees to a date and turns up not knowing that he is being stitched up I’d argue is not worthy of blame – it’s only when he sees loads of other guys as well and then realizes it is not actually a date, but a con and does not leave that I’d label him a fool.

  64. BD, the only part of this that is acceptable (to me) is the turning up and only the turning up. A guy who agrees to a date and turns up not knowing that he is being stitched up I’d argue is not worthy of blame – it’s only when he sees loads of other guys as well and then realizes it is not actually a date, but a con and does not leave that I’d label him a fool.

    I more or less agree, but as another commenter pointed out already, it really depends on what these guys were told. All of these guys agreed to whatever they were told; none of them dictated where and when this “date” would occur.

    As I said above, if they were told something normal and non-beta like “I’ll meet you at a Starbucks,” then fine, I don’t blame them for showing up.

    But if they were told something weird (“You have to meet me at this park at exactly 11am”) or beta (“Let’s have lunch at this restaurant”), then I’m back to blaming them again. But again, I don’t know exactly what they were told.

  65. I am still waiting for men starting to post #metoo when they have a shitty date who wasted their time or when a girl refused sex. But I guess men are too pussy to do that. And the ones who arent have better things to do… still would be hilarious to see.

    start dating and learning how to turn on women over 40.  I get nearly raped by women over 40.  Press the right buttons and next thing you know you’re getting gropped..

  66. But if they were told something weird (“You have to meet me at this park at exactly 11am”) or beta (“Let’s have lunch at this restaurant”), then I’m back to blaming them again. But again, I don’t know exactly what they were told.

    I have never had a women tell me where she wanted to meet unless I was traveling to her town and I specifically asked her where the best place was.  It isn’t normal female behavior.

  67. But again, I don’t know exactly what they were told.

    The Twitter guy quotes “her” (actually some Indian guy, presumably following a script) as saying

    HEY IM FINALLY FREE LMAO… my friend is DJing near Union square around 6 tomorrow I was wondering if you wanted to go for a bit

    followed up by

    amazing I’m gonna be running around today and tomorrow but just come around 6 and I’ll meet you by the stage then we’ll head out

    which sounds reasonable. Well, if it was me, I would respond with something like “So you’re free at 6? Let’s meet at [some nearby establishment]. 18:15?” to avoid possible competition and judgement from her friend(s). The wording is somewhat ambiguous as to whether the DJing starts or ends at 6, if it’s the former she’s in effect proposing an event date which is bad, if it’s the latter, why not. That’s what I would think in the blind at least. Not sure what would I do if “she” was adamant in only meeting in the square, as that’s still a reasonable request when meeting a man for the first time.

    I have never had a women tell me where she wanted to meet unless I was traveling to her town and I specifically asked her where the best place was.  It isn’t normal female behavior.

    I have, but very rarely. Yes, it isn’t normal. Hard to make conclusions with this few data points, but I had sex with some of those women as well, so it isn’t a death sentence.

  68. I have never had a women tell me where she wanted to meet unless I was traveling to her town and I specifically asked her where the best place was.  It isn’t normal female behavior.

    I have, but like anon said it’s not usual. Correct, it’s not normal female behavior. That’s part of my point.

  69. HEY IM FINALLY FREE LMAO… my friend is DJing near Union square around 6 tomorrow I was wondering if you wanted to go for a bit

    followed up by

    amazing I’m gonna be running around today and tomorrow but just come around 6 and I’ll meet you by the stage then we’ll head out

    Yeah that’s definitely a grey area since the guy said he was already going to be in the area. However, meeting “by the stage” “around 6” would never be specific enough for me; I would nail down something much more specific.

  70. start dating and learning how to turn on women over 40.  I get nearly raped by women over 40.  Press the right buttons and next thing you know you’re getting gropped..

    Good for you, but I dont find such women attractive at all (yet?). With maybe some highly unusual exceptions like Katheryn Winnick. But that is def not the norm of what a 40 year old woman looks like.

    I have never had a women tell me where she wanted to meet unless I was traveling to her town and I specifically asked her where the best place was.  It isn’t normal female behavior.

    Yes indeed, usually they want you to be choosing a place even if you are acting beta and indecisive. So a woman insisting on a specific place and time should raise some doubts already at the very least.

    which sounds reasonable. Well, if it was me, I would respond with something like “So you’re free at 6? Let’s meet at [some nearby establishment]. 18:15?” to avoid possible competition and judgement from her friend(s). The wording is somewhat ambiguous as to whether the DJing starts or ends at 6, if it’s the former she’s in effect proposing an event date which is bad, if it’s the latter, why not. That’s what I would think in the blind at least. Not sure what would I do if “she” was adamant in only meeting in the square, as that’s still a reasonable request when meeting a man for the first time.

    Exactly. That too should raise some doubts/red flags. You really don’t wanna meet her where anyone she knows is gonna be around.

     

    I have, but very rarely. Yes, it isn’t normal. Hard to make conclusions with this few data points, but I had sex with some of those women as well, so it isn’t a death sentence.

    I have also met such women. Thing to do is to always suggest another place / time and see how she responds. In my experience the woman always responds positively to that. So if she didn’t that would raise massive red flags. I have been suggesting other places / times always even long before I knew anything about anything just because when you let a woman chose they usually pick shitty locations that are terrible for first dates. Its funny how such women then often complain how theyre date didnt go so well. Suprise suprise!

    Yeah that’s definitely a grey area since the guy said he was already going to be in the area. However, meeting “by the stage” “around 6” would never be specific enough for me; I would nail down something much more specific.

    Whats more is when you look at the video its basically just large crowd of guys only waiting there. What kind of man would wait in that kind of crowd for his “date” to meet there? Not to mention how weird and unnatural the whole setting is. Then you see the faces of all those guys who are genuinely surprised. Its so absurd.

  71. Wow, fantastic article! I will do a blog post on it.

    Good fodder for your blog, and you did have an interesting take down of so called hook up culture.

    One immediate takeaway in the piece is thier counter to the 80/20 rule is: well, it’s more like the top 20% guys get half the sex, not 80%. They seem to be hedging a bit….50% (or 80%) of the sex is different than 50% (or 80%) of the women.

     

  72. All of women’s needs are solved by society.  Women have scholarships for being female, cushy office job preference, welfare state as backup, courts preference during divorce and custody battles, and vibrators which most women claim feel better than sex.  So men are now an accessory.  With each generation women reject more and more men since the demand for men has plummeted.  Men are to blame, sure, but only because of voting for politicians that support this stuff.  Many guys on this blog would have voted for the same politicians thinking they were being modern and sticking it to the tradcon christians.

     

    It didnt look like 1000 dudes.  Maybe a couple hundred.  Im sure many, many more didnt fall for it than did.

  73. Im sure many, many more didnt fall for it than did.

    Are you sure non-participation implied not falling for it, as opposed to lack of confidence in oneself? I can feel some of the guys thinking “I can never outrun/out-push-up/out-whatever those manly men, and the prize, this angel will never be mine”.

  74. I can’t save society but I can sure take advantage of the decline.

    This man gets it!

    All of women’s needs are solved by society.  Women have scholarships for being female, cushy office job preference, welfare state as backup, courts preference during divorce and custody battles, and vibrators which most women claim feel better than sex.  So men are now an accessory.

    Sad but true. But the reverse has been true for awhile, especially back in the day when women were literally told how they could live their lives and stuff and could literally do nothing about it. We’ve gone from patriarchal to matriarchal. I think both power structures suck for both sexes in their own ways.

    Men are to blame, sure, but only because of voting for politicians that support this stuff. Many guys on this blog would have voted for the same politicians thinking they were being modern and sticking it to the tradcon christians.

    The trad-cons I believe actually allow matriarchal societies to emerge in and of themselves because of their very bad habit of overvaluing women and placing them on pedestals. Women’s movements took advantage of the trad-con’s obsession with protecting women from their own “bad” decisions and look what happened. Now we have women who seek to protect men from their own “bad” decisions.

    We should have never given women the playbook. Men should never give women any agency. I treat all the women in my life almost exactly like the men in my life in that none of them are “special” to me (I still have sex with them and stuff but that’s about it).

  75. Men are to blame, sure, but only because of voting for politicians that support this stuff.

    Not “only.” That is one of many reasons.

     Many guys on this blog would have voted for the same politicians thinking they were being modern and sticking it to the tradcon christians.

    Correct.

    Are you sure non-participation implied not falling for it, as opposed to lack of confidence in oneself? I can feel some of the guys thinking “I can never outrun/out-push-up/out-whatever those manly men, and the prize, this angel will never be mine

    Correct. This is what I was thinking.

    Remember, most men are betas, not Alphas.

  76. Are you sure non-participation implied not falling for it, as opposed to lack of confidence in oneself? I can feel some of the guys thinking “I can never outrun/out-push-up/out-whatever those manly men, and the prize, this angel will never be mine”.

    Its funny because none of those supposedly manly men got the prize either.

    All of women’s needs are solved by society.

    Theyre pathological need for male attention is another thing though. The issue is again the fact that there are so many betas who give it to them for free. Can you imagine what it would be like to live in some place where no man agrees to spend time with / talk to a woman hes not sleeping with? The women would literally throw themselves at you, even if everything was taken care of.

    Sad but true. But the reverse has been true for awhile, especially back in the day when women were literally told how they could live their lives and stuff and could literally do nothing about it. We’ve gone from patriarchal to matriarchal. I think both power structures suck for both sexes in their own ways.

    The situation is that women become too picky and too bitchy and too unloyal to the point they are rarely if every satisfied. Then you have the situation that there are so many single over 30s with rapidly degrading looks and there are less and less quality men who are interested into them each year. There is also a lot of family, social and biological pressure then on them to “get the family life together”. This often leads into a life of frustration. Many women now have serious psychological issues because of this, often now even at younger ages. I think BD once said that he estimates about a quarter of women living in the west now have issues on the level that could be classified as disorder. After having gone on a lot of dates and met and talked to a lot of these women and also reading various articles from different sides and discussing with others I have to say that my observation is that this is unfortunately true.

    I am not even sure anymore if I can still think its possible to have a real relationship with a woman – one where I am not her therapist.

  77. David,

     

    So what if society takes care of womens needs?  Why do you want the honour?

    The welfare state is great. It liberates men. And women still want sex.

  78. I am not even sure anymore if I can still think its possible to have a real relationship with a woman – one where I am not her therapist.

    It kind of isn’t tbh. Which is why I just stick to having a bunch of fbs.

    The welfare state is great. It liberates men.

    Um, how? How does a welfare state liberate anybody, especially men?

  79. Why do you want the honour?

     

     

    Good argument.  No.  I am a lifelong player and im def not relationship or marriage  material.  I have too many hobbies and hate most of women’s opinions about anything.  So i have enjoyed the decline, defiling hot college girls while rejecting maniacal thirty somethings who thought sex and the city was a true story lol.

    But, if I was born in the fifties, I would have assumed that provider position as my role in exchange for a “good woman.”  My dad fell on the sword twice, two costly divorces, and his daughters are estranged too.  Thats what he gets for trying to be honorable.

     

    And fyi the welfare state has turned our economy into a bottomless pit of debt.  It might work temporarily in rich white countries, land-locked by similar countries with strict citizenship rules and high IQ, hardworking citizens, but as your demographics change… I hope you have a backup plan.

  80. Joelsuf, lets compare with some of what appears to anger americans as left wing with the actual “left wing hell hole” where I live.

    – marriage contracts protecting wealth: never contested because they will never be set aside.

    – alimony: it barely exists outside extreme cases. Or its peanuts. It never goes to court. That wouldnt make sense because the courts would offer women nothing.

    – child support: this does exist, as it should, but for people on low income, its virtually nothing.

    – prostitution: this is of course legal. Why on earth should anyone interfere with the motives of consenting adults for having sex.

    – campus rape. No one here would believe that this is a thing. I have read about it and still struggle to believe you can be thrown out of university if the greek professor think you might have done something. This left wing hell hole has a sort of odd system with courts of law and standards such as reasonable doubt. They deal with rape charges. And no, an accused student wouldnt be harassed on campus by feminist mobs or such things. Because that doesnt exist either.

    Metoo: come on, who cares.

     

    The underlying reason for all of the above is that the welfare state doesnt need to attack men in all situations to make them fund wome

     

    David, good on you, but why do you need to “hate” womens opinions or ” defile” college students? Why not just appreciate women and have sex with college students? Even in america I wou!d assume this is allowed.

    In this left wing hell hole, a politician had drunken sex with a 15- year-old some years back. While controversial, it wasnt illegal and he was quickly forgiven.

    Women dont hate men. Young women dont hate old men. Feminists dont matter. In my home town a light rail system recently opened. Linking the city centre to the university, it will be heavily used by young women. A male celebrity was given the honour of recording station names. He has many claims to fame from making films to commenting sports. At the age of 75 he spent winters in Haiti where had installed 17 year old black girlfriends. This doesnt stop a left wing city council in a lef wing country honouring and celebrating him in order to be popular with all the young women who like this old man.

     

    There isjust no reason to invents all sorts of left wing feminist imaginary threats

  81. The underlying reason for all of the above is that the welfare state doesnt need to attack men in all situations to make them fund women.

    That’s only cuz the place you live is very sex positive. Women are “allowed” to be horny there and don’t care as much about the things that horny men do. Never said those places weren’t good places to get with chicks. There’s always been a narrative of sexual freedom in Europe. But how much freedom of enterprise and property is there? I’m more concerned with the latter than the former.

    Even in the US where there are more laws against men involving meeting and having sex with chicks, all you gotta do with chicks is mention them, have a laugh about it (most chicks think these laws are dumb too, the manosphere, especially the closet homosexual incels are wrong when they cry that all chicks are feminists and paradoxically feminists are some of the horniest women out there lol), and boom.

    I was talking about the welfare state as a whole and what it eventually grows into over time, which is government appropriation over everything, complete with curfews and other forms of martial law, all in “the interest of the people.”

    Unless it is libertarian socialism (and even that is a stretch), socialism in any form will eventually grow into communist authoritarian regimes which often require bloody revolutions (which nowadays would be stopped immediately by nuke wielding members of the national guard) to stop. The worst thing that capitalism grows into is corporatism which is what the US has. Which still sucks, but sucks a little less than the government taking 80% of the money I make so that I (and people who don’t want to be productive) can get meh goods from them.

    I mean you do you, but I’m good on the welfare state. If the welfare state makes you happy that’s cool. It’s just not for me.

  82. Ha ha, ANTEKIRT, good point. But I love Sweden. Its an endless source of light entertainment.

    But its different countries with very different histories over the last centuries. Denmark, a small peninsula on top of germany right next to England, has spent 200 years looking fearful to the south and hopeful to the west and never bothering much with big empty sweden to the east.

    In between suffering occupation during ww2 and a disastrous military defeat in 1864, Denmark was also a hapless superpower playground during the first world war, being the scene of both the first ever attack from an air craft carrier as well as the biggest ever naval battle in world history.

    Sweden were far-removed from all this, much more influenced from the east, they retain a much more authoritarian culture. This is also a feature of the respective welfare states. In sweden its about how they believe people should live, in Denmark its solely about redistribution. This is not always the same thing. I could mock sweden here with several examples but to be fair, there are areas where some might prefer Sweden.

    Far more people in Denmark smoke, for instance, quite simply because even on this issue voters dont appreciate government interference. In sweden, alcohol is sold in pharmacy-like government shops. Any politician trying to implement that in Denmark where its sold everywhere, even to children, would quickly need to find a new job.

    But all countries in europe are different, with different cultures, languages and complicated histories. My point is just that its much more about culture than simplified ideology as often coming from americans utterly commited to the “left wing welfare state =  bad end of world disaster”  narrative.

  83. Joelsuf,

    I doubt there are big differences between the US and Denmark regarding “property and enterprise”. As far as I know both countries rank very well on most business friendly surveys and may not be as different as you might think. Except taxation. When you buy a car, well pay for two. Fill it up, well petrol is also doubled by taxation. But is that the definition of socialism?,

    Southern european countries are more socialist in my opinion even if they end up re-distributing less

     

    I dont think you can consider sex-positivity seperate from the welfare state. In non-welfare states weaker women will save themselves by marrying “up” This will influence cultural norms and make it normal for women to depend on men. Some men may love that. I dont. You cant have unrestrained sex-positivity if women need to think like that.

    Welfare states need not develop into communist socialist oppressive states. Why should they?

  84. Welfare states need not develop into communist socialist oppressive states. Why should they?

    Well I don’t want them to either, and of course they shouldn’t, but absolute power corrupts absolutely. Throughout history, welfare states have ALWAYS degenerate into communist socialist oppressive states.

    I dont think you can consider sex-positivity seperate from the welfare state. 

    I do kind of agree with that. I’m hoping that it is possible to one day not have welfare states AND sex positivity. But in order to do that we’d have to seriously consider the very deeply rooted and developed institutions of marriage and government. That’s just how it goes I suppose…

    Except taxation. When you buy a car, well pay for two. Fill it up, well petrol is also doubled by taxation. But is that the definition of socialism?,

    That’s actually more the definition of totalitarianism and even Absolutism. Only half a millennium ago, royal families were literally stealing property and money from people.

    And now “elected” officials do that today, only under different circumstances and we’re totally cool with it. Someone who knows what is best for you taking things that you earn so that they can decide who gets what resources is a rather cruel thing to do.

    There is no real difference between Absolutism in the 16th century and what we have now. People who know what is best for us STILL take money and resources from us without our permission, and citizens STILL can’t do anything about it.

    And even more sad, we have all the tools necessary to become an anarcho-capitalist (or anarcho-communist) society but we just choose not to, at our own expense.

  85. Thomas Nordic, I don’t disagree with everything you say but I need a clarification from you here:

    So what if society takes care of womens needs?  Why do you want the honour?
    The welfare state is great. It liberates men. And women still want sex.

    “Society” here is clearly “men”, if the point is to use taxes to take care of women’s needs. Under this light a gynocentric welfare state seems like more of the same – men nannying women while being screamed at that they’re equal. If the goal is to reduce government intervention but keep a baseline of social safety nets, why not simply tell women that it’s their fucking responsibility to not have kids when they lack the resources to handle a pregnancy and raise kids on their own? (Let’s assume some minimal female-specific welfare is allowed to address issues less dependent on personal choice such as female contraception or whatever)

    OR just admit that society need kids and that the birth rate would plummet catastrophically if women only ever had them when it doesn’t preclude “equal” financial success with men, and make peace with a somewhat unequal average income – though obviously for the same job and position salaries should indeed be equal.

  86. Antekirtt, you seem to be arguing whether a welfare state helps raise kids right and whether it works well in general. Who cares.

    But whether one should move to a more left-leaning or a right-leaning state, whether that’s a good predictor of women’s sex-positiveness, now those are valid questions.

    Consider a simple strategy. Move to Europe, become a Portuguese NHR and pay zero taxes, live elsewhere in the EU wherever women are pretty and liberated, prices are decent and the overall standard of living is not conducive to thugs and bums, be prepared to leave in case Caleb is right and Europe eventually collapses. Where are the disadvantages?

  87. @Anon: I’m following Thomas’ line of thinking and asking for clarification; doesn’t mean I’m necessarily invested in “fixing society” nor that I disagree with the alpha 2.0 imperative of following what’s good for my personal happiness regardless of where the world is headed.

  88. But I love Sweden.

    Which of these do you love more?

    1. Muslim rape gangs

    2. Totalitarian hate speech laws

    3. State run media

    4. Totalitarian “non-consensual acts during consensual sex” laws

    I dont think you can consider sex-positivity seperate from the welfare state.

    Are you serious? America has plenty of sex-positive women who make their own money, start their own businesses, and have sex drives that are so high that there is no way they can withhold sex from men in order to parasite off of men’s financial assets.

    In non-welfare states weaker women will save themselves by marrying “up”

    Yes, that’s a problem. But the solution isn’t socialism (theft of my property).

    The solution is for betas to man up (which is what this community is for) so that these “weaker women” can starve to death.

    In other words, the solution is justice, not state-sponsored parasitism.

    This will influence cultural norms and make it normal for women to depend on men.

    And yet, truly high sex drive women are resisting these cultural norms.

    Some men may love that. I dont.

    Alpha 1s, tradcons, and unattractive betas who have nothing to offer women but money.

    You cant have unrestrained sex-positivity if women need to think like that.

    So what you’re saying is that in a capitalist system, the only truly sex-positive women are strong, individualistic, and high sex drive women, who would be genuinely sex-positive in any system.

    Whereas in a socialist system, both strong women and weak women are sex-positive and you can’t tell the difference between the female winners and the dead weight.

    This is yet another reason to support capitalism. Capitalism exposes truth and within truth there is beauty and justice.

    Let’s all protect each other’s property together! Support blogs and communities like this one. Encourage men to man up. Stop providing for women. And let the weak ones starve and die! It’s called justice!

    Long live capitalism!

     

  89. Joelsuf,

    When you say that welfare states always turn into oppressve totalitarian states, which are you thinking of?

    I dont consider taxation as theft or absolutism or anything similar. Voters decide. The concept of a welfare states is backed by everyone here, though interpreted different!y. That wouldnt be the case if there was any evidence that it ruined the economy or !imited personal freedom.

    Personally, I ultimately dont care. Do I directly or indirectly pay 40 or 60 % in all forms of taxation. It may sound a lot but I get a lot back in the form of things that I would otherwise buy. I may have a net loss but its probably more like 10% or 20 % or whatever. I dont lose sleep over that. Especially when it helps things work well.

    And ultimately, denmark is probably not that different from the US when considering the average americans need to pay for education and health.

     

    Antekirt,

    When I say that a welfare state takes care of womens needs that was relative to a non-welfare state, where men will fund women, because of the cultural norms that are guaranteed to develop.

    Actually women can get children here bythemselves, with insemination delivered free by the state which will also pay the child support that would otherwise come from men as well as all the money to childcare etc. And I think thats great. They are providing the future tax payers.

     

    Anon, sure you dont need to care about politics but I find not caring about anything but one self as somewhat boring and unsatisying. Its -almost – as stupid as all those angry people who are just shouting pointlessly at the world. In fact having a general interest in politics or cultural developments is probably also likely to make you more aware of personal opportunities

  90. Jack,

    I like capitalism too. I have seen some argue that Denmark is more capitalist than the US though thats probably a question of definition. Capitalism is needed to fund a welfare state.

    But I dont want people dying in the street.  You may consider that fair. I dont. And ultimately, you willnot gain from that. Lots of desperate people will lead to things that will likely be a bigger inconvenience to you than actually avoid them starving.

    I said I loved sweden in a context. That said, I do like the place, apart from their authoritarian streak. I move state funded tv. Not as a stand-alone but I certainly consider the BBC as infinitely better than say the blatant lies of crap like Fox news

    As for freedom of speech, I am not sure its better in the US. Laws matter less than culture and it seems quite restricted what you can say in the US even if there are no laws.

    And all the bans on language,naked women, alcohol, prostitution etc. Its hardly land of the free

  91. Lots of desperate people will lead to things that will likely be a bigger inconvenience to you than actually avoid them starving.

    Agreed. I’d still prefer a system that distinguishes can’t-poor/won’t-poor somehow, but provided it’s not crazy high (like those 1500 or even 2000 Euro proposals in some places) I’m not fundamentally opposed to something like a UBI.
    I’m more worried by megacorps and multi-billionaires than by whether or not hard-working self-employed people with a net worth of $1-10 million are evading some of their taxes.

  92. I’m looking hard, but I don’t see any capitalism in the West, only corporatism.

    Capitalism is not so much a political system, more a natural law like say the Law of Gravity.

    Capitalism is simply the free exchange of value and is unlikely to be seen again due to most of the brainwashed masses confusing capitalism and corporatism.

  93. I’m looking hard, but I don’t see any capitalism in the West, only corporatism. Capitalism is not so much a political system, more a natural law like say the Law of Gravity. Capitalism is simply the free exchange of value and is unlikely to be seen again due to most of the brainwashed masses confusing capitalism and corporatism.

    Legit, we’ve had corporatism ever since the New Deal showed the government that all they need to do is get sponsored by a very select few who have lots of money. And because war has been the US’s religion since the War of 1812 (the first “pointless” war that the US was involved in), its been very easy for massive corporations and massive government to enjoy a symbiotic relationship.

    Eliminating both of these is the dream of Anarcho Capitalism. But its too bad that whatever citizens arm themselves with can be outdone by the government. I haven’t seen any citizens around here own tanks, bazookas or nukes. And yes I believe citizens should have the right to own all three.

    the good news is that there are just some small tweeks we need to make to fix most of the issues.

    Yup, nothing to it. Just don’t give chicks any agency (treat them like any man except you have sex with them pretty much), talk about sex with them a lot (which is socially acceptable now), and that’s about it. No need to walk eggshells around them or anything. No need to worry about consent laws since they don’t apply to anybody who has rapport with a chick and if you aren’t sending unsolicited dick pics to anybody (really doubt anybody reading this blog is that socially retarded).

  94. When you say that welfare states always turn into oppressve totalitarian states, which are you thinking of?

    All of the Axis (and Central) powers in World War II (except the US which was on its way there because of the New Deal), Venezuela, Israel (they require anyone over 18 to join the military. How nice), nearly all of Eastern Europe. Those are all places where statism is at an all time high and is showing very few signs of slowing down.

    I don’t consider taxation as theft or absolutism or anything similar.

    Cool. Then paypal me half of your income right now or I’ll send troops to collect everything you own. I know what’s best for you but can’t prove it. But the law says that you need to do this.

    That totally isn’t theft, right? People who claim to know what’s best for you being able to do this without being challenged (even in the form of bloody revolution since they’ll just run you over with a tank or nuke your city if you gather anybody to fight them) totally isn’t absolutism either.

    Voters decide.

    Since when?

    I like capitalism too.

    And yet you’re cool with stuff like taxes and government appropriation of property (which, again, in the west can happen to anybody for any reason, even if you “own” the property).

    Again I’m not trying to save the planet from disease. Although I shame statism quite a bit, no one will ever find me being an idiot like Adam Kokesh and getting arrested to prove a point lol.

    If you prefer welfare states then more power too you. But Anarcho-Capitalism (or even Anarcho-Communism) is clearly the “least bad” way of governing, with Libertarian Socialism (different places can have welfare states but NO federal or *shudder* global welfare states) being a very distant second. What the US and Western Europe has, corporatism, being right down there with federal welfare states aka socialism.

    But as JOTB so eloquently said (its one of the things where we agree), (most) chicks, Alpha 1s, trad-cons, and progressive betas are in clear denial of this, because they know if we were to have real AnCap, their perceived value would plummet.

    If we didn’t have a welfare state that legit rewards chicks who have lots of irresponsible unprotected sex, and have tons of kids and does all they can to get the father out of their lives while sitting on their asses doing nothing but getting alimony and child support checks, trust me things would be way better for everybody. Single moms who rely on this for support are degenerates and deserved to be shamed hard. Just like the alpha 1 idiots who refuse to have protected sex. These two groups make things really difficult for people like us who don’t believe in taxes and “public goods.”

  95. a welfare state that legit rewards chicks who have lots of irresponsible unprotected sex

    Sounds perfect! Where do I sign up for lots of irresponsible unprotected sex?

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