Based on my observations and studies of female behavior, it’s clear to me that most women (not all, but most) start to clean up their act and become adults when they hit age 23. At age 22 and below, women are essentially teenagers, regardless of the fact that the first digit of their age might be a “2” instead of a “1.” During this time, they do things like:

  • Drink too much
  • Often smoke too much or do drugs
  • Grossly mishandle their money (if indeed they have any)
  • Can’t hold a job
  • Repeatedly get into horrible (and sometimes abusive) relationships
  • Get very promiscuous and fuck way too many guys in dangerous ways (i.e. while not using condoms)
  • Rely on government assistance of some kind in order to pay their bills (paid for by hardworking people like you and me)
  • Often get married under very stupid and unsustainable circumstances
  • Spend way too much time having fun instead of earning / improving their income
  • Lie a lot
  • Engage in near-constant drama
  • Rely on their mothers way more than an adult should

They do this because they’re teenagers. Assuming a woman will suddenly stop acting like a teenager as soon as she turns 20 (or 21, or 22) is a huge mistake many people make. She’s a damn teenager until she hits 23. I’ve spoken about this before.

The good news is that when they hit 23, most women (not all, but most) stop doing the drugs, stop drinking except for once or twice a year, start to maintain regular employment, get a little choosier about the men they have sex with, and more or less are able to maintain normal lives. They still have problems and they’re still stressed out about things, because that’s how women are, but at least they’ve graduated from adolescence into adulthood.

That’s women. Now let’s talk about men. This is where things are going to get uncomfortable for many of you.

If women turn into adults at age 23, at what age do men turn into adults?

Several decades ago when I was a young man, this age 23 zone was about the same for men. Men transformed from man boys into adults at around age 23 or 24, usually when they left college or had a few years of work experience under their belt.

Several decades before that, men turned into adults at age 17 or 18. I have spoken to many old men who lament about men today. “Back when I was 20,” they say, “I had a house, job, wife, two kids, paid my bills, and was responsible. Today, men who are 20 are living with their mommas playing those damn video games.”

As you can see, the age at which men become adults has been rising. Worse, since the dawning of our new left-wing culture in the 90s, this rate has accelerated.

At what age to men turn into adults today? You’re not going to like my answer.

It’s about age 34.

That’s right. I’m no expert, but if I had to pinpoint an age at which the typical, modern, Western man in the 21st century stops acting like a man boy and starts behaving like a mature, real adult, it would be around age 34. Of course there are exceptions to this; I’m just giving you the average.

If you look around, we now have an entire population of men in their 30s who do things like the items I listed above when women act like teenagers, as well as:

  • Still live at home with their parents
  • Spend a signifigant amount of time playing video games (often the mindless “shoot-em” video games originally meant for children)
  • Have never made more than $30,000 a year in income
  • Regularly get into high-drama relationships
  • Act very needy and oneitisy with women (like a teenager would), even if they’re Alphas (1.0).
  • Lose their tempers quickly for very small reasons (like a child would)

This has been the trend I’ve been clearly seeing over the last 20 years. Grown men becoming more and more like children, or at least like teenagers. It is the most disheartening thing about the collapse of Western civilization and I’ve mentioned this several times before.

The statistics reflect this as well. You’ve probably already heard that women graduate college in higher numbers than men, and that women in their 20s make more money than men in their 20s as long as they don’t have kids.

I’m not the only one noticing this; women complain about this too. Since women are achieving adulthood at around age 23 and men are doing it at around age 34, you now have an entire population of people age 23-34 where adult women are dating man boys. Women are starting to get very pissed off about this, and it’s going to get worse. I realize women complain about men regardless, but in the last 10 years I’ve noticed women complaining about the immature behavior from the men they’re dating, and I’ve been surprised at how often the women are actually correct about this. These guys are acting like children.

That’s why this recent trend of younger women dating much older men is going to increase. The main reason behind this is because of economic reasons caused by our slowly collapsing economies. But the second reason is this childification of the modern man. Many younger women are getting sick and tired of dating men in their late 20s and 30s who have constant financial problems and spend their time playing video games. This is forcing younger women to do something they’ve never done before; date men over age 35. I predict that over the next few decades, as the economy continues to worsen and as Western men become more and more beta and child-like, you’ll see more young women in their late teens and early to mid 20s date men well over the age of 35. (And yes, those over-33 women are going to hate it.)

The childification of men will get worse. Men remaining man boys longer and longer is a growing trend that will not stop any time soon. At some point in the next few years/decades, this 34 number will rise to 40, and even beyond, particularly as the permanently brainwashed Millennial generation ages into their 40s. Imagine that; an entire population of men in their early 40s who sit around smoking weed, playing Nintendo and Pokemon Go, who have never made more than $30,000 a year, still live with parents or roommates, and who constantly have high-drama, needy relationships with the women unfortunate enough to date them.

As I keep saying at the CJ Blog and as Aaron Clarey first opined, enjoy the decline!

The Difference Between Being a Man Boy and Having Child-Like Qualities

One possible objection to this might be something like,

Wait a minute BD. You said you play computer games too! And watch superhero movies and shit! Who’s the man boy now?

We need to differentiate between a man boy and a grown adult who occasionally engages in more child-like activities. There’s a very clear difference.

I haven’t played a computer game in about a year. When I do play computer games, I set my timer for one hour, play, and when the timer goes off I put the game away and get back to work. At one point in my life I did play a lot of computer games…when I was young. When I was a kid. Back when I was 21, I used to spend hours on end playing Ultima until 2am in the morning. That’s what kids do.

Today, as an adult, yeah, occasionally I do kid stuff like watch a cartoon or go see a movie aimed at people younger than me. But I also make a six figure income (since I was 27 years old), run three businesses, have built a decent financial infrastructure from scratch, live alone, don’t rely on family or government to pay my bills, and have raised two successful children. Because I’m an adult. The typical 20s or 30s man boy that I see walking around in society today has done none of these things. Worse, if you tell them to grow up and start working on these things, they actually complain it’s too much work. (Then I go back to my free and happy life and have sex with the hot young women these men can’t, even though I’m in my 40s.)

I’ve said it before, and I’ll probably say it again…

1. If you are over the age of about 24 and still live at home with parents, or make a low income, or spend a lot of time playing video games or getting drunk, GROW THE FUCK UP AND GET TO WORK. Stop being a goddamn child and make something of yourself. Build your financial empire so you can be happy and free. Getting my book would be a good start.

2. If you actually are an adult (not in numerical age, but in regards to behavior) structure your love life and your financial life to deal with the reality that most men under the age of 34 are not full adults, and that this Age of Childishness will increase as Western civilization continues its slow decline. All of this stuff is going to get much worse. Prepare.

Edit/Update – I don’t normally do this, but since some of the comments on this blog post are so depressing, I’m going to paste a comment I made below in response to them. Based on many of the comments below, this comment will address some of the objections a few of you have:

To you more angry, depressed, or right-wingish guys:

1. Just because women suck doesn’t mean men don’t suck too. Just because the other “team” is fucking things up badly doesn’t mean your “team” is doing everything right and should never be criticized.

Yes, women are real problems today. I have written scores of articles on this blog regarding that very topic. Check out the archive for more on that.

But men are also real problems today, which means men need to be criticized too. Harshly so. Again, that doesn’t mean I’m defending women or think that women are doing everything right. Obviously the opposite it the case. It means I’m calling men out for their pussy bullshit and their contributions to the very problems many of you guys are complaining about.

Remember, I’m not here to take sides like you guys. I’m here to report things as objectivity as possible so that men can become better. I’m going to call women out for their crap, and men out for their crap. Both are guilty.

2. If I talk about low-income men who live at home with their parents and play video games too much, and your first thought is “Well women suck today so why should I bother doing any more work than that?”, then you’re showing how completely and utterly warped your mind has become.

You should want to make more money FOR YOU, not for some woman! You should want to build a business FOR YOU, not for some woman! You should want to live in your own place and be a free man FOR YOU, not for some woman!

If all you can think about is how these things will affect possible women in your life, you have become entirely woman-centric in your thinking. You should want to make good money and live a free and independent life even if you never plan on have sex with a woman ever again. Read this article here. You need it.

3. When you guys use manosphere-nerd phrases like “feminist grrl-power” or “value signal” and things like that, it shows that you’re a little too trapped in your alt-right / MGTOW manosphere bubble. In my opinion, you really need to back off on the time and emotion you spend reading manosphere sites (I barely read any, and I write for one!) and spend more time getting out in the real world increasing your income, achieving your goals and your Mission, getting laid, and improving your health and fitness.

This anger and resentment isn’t going to make you a better man.

182 Comments on “The Childification of Men

  1. It’s been said for quite a while now that 30 is the new 20. Incidents of street brawls, drunkenness and overall over the top behaviour is still occcuring late into the thirties when we’d hope perhaps that 24 or so would be the very upper limit with most juvenile behaviour occurring at around 18-19. No longer it seems. 🙁

  2. Casey Anthony (Look her up.) certainly proves your point about

    the women. She was 22 when she got into trouble with the law for

    killing her daughter. She engaged in all the stuff you wrote about.

    Psychology Today magazine calls it “The emerging adult.”

    A new segment of life between the ages of 18 and 25.

    She’s doing fairly well now at age 30, but at such a cost.

    It’s a shame there aren’t more bloggers as astute as you. Some of this

    stuff could be avoided.

  3. Is this an activist post? Why would you care about the manboys. You pointed out how their existence benefits you (and your readers) greatly. I can’t decide if you are trying to tell these men to grow up to garner conflict clicks or if you are actually are wasting your time being concerned with the men that make your life possible. If all these men were to grow up, the life of your readers (and to a lesser extent yours) would worsen.

     

    That being said, manboys are not going anywhere. For some of them it is because they never learned how to grow up. For others, it is because they have no desire to grow up as they content with what they have (genuine MGTOWS). To some extent I envy them. I sometimes wish I lacked ambition. I am a simple guy and could be VERY happy on a measly 30k per year income. Unfortunately, my ego will not allow me to “settle”. So back to work I go.

  4. Wow. Your analysis is spot on as usual.

    Even though I’ve been a doctor for 10 years, left momma’s house around the same time, have been in a long relationship that ended 2 years ago, and make a decent income for my country, I would say I only started to feel and act as an adult last year at 34.

    Are you a wizard or something? (No sarcasm)

  5. The opportunities that men had in the past are gone. College is a fucking scam unless you are in STEM (and you still gotta compete with HB1 visas), the union factory jobs are gone , and the cost of living is higher than ever. Some of these men are simply making a cost benifit analysis and choosing video games, weed , online porn and drinking. If Ford was hiring straight out of high school paying $40 an hour and the economy was like it was in 1974 all these “man boys” would be gainfully employed-but that is the past.

    Now even with a Law degree you would be lucky to pull $50,000 a year, and you still have to put up with bullshit office politics and student loans. Get used to how things are going because it is going to get worse as more men check out as the system is failing. Want men to grow up and get a job, a mortgage, marry and have kids? Hit the reset button, bring jobs back from China, raise wages, and adjust housing prices back to realistic levels. Also fuck women and their fucking anger, they wanted equal rights and they got them-welcome to the world of overwork, low pay and little recognition. When women entered the workforce where did they think the jobs would come from? They drove down wages by doubling the workforce-then came outsourcing. Women get hired before men to such a degree that they call our present economic situation a “mancession “.

    I don’t blame the men who play video games , smoke weed, drink, fuck tinder dates , and watch online porn in their mom’s basement-women need to adjust to the new normal, get their shit together and adjust their standards. Men have already adjusted to the new normal-Porn Hub, Call of Duty, purple haze and craft beers got them covered.

  6. This trend is rather baffling for me. This week I was (somewhat jokingly) called a ‘loser’ by some of my co-workers, because I don’t play Pokemon Go (I’m 38). I almost felt like I was in some sort of reverse, Twilight Zone, kind of world, where geek was the new cool 🙂

    On the one hand, I don’t really care what people do, as long it makes them happy and I also don’t want to become a grumpy old man.

    On the other hand, there are so many other things you can do that are more rewarding and can enrich your life.

    I myself still occasionally enjoy a superhero-movie or play videogames, but like I said, too much other great things to do: traveling (planning trips to Rome and Colombia), making music and of course, dating and having sex with women.

    The only positive thing about Pokemon Go which springs to mind: at least they’re outside now.  I can see a lot of fat guys walking their asses of with some color on their cheecks, which would otherwise be pasty white.

  7. Once again spot on.

    We are about the same age and I did notice the same trend. From my gut I would have put the age a bit higher, at around 35-36 even for childless males. For men with children the age is lower, at around 28 from my observation.

    One question remains: Why would the hopeless males in an age of insanity *want* to grow up and build a life when the other option; a live of weakness as a child is so much easier and quite frequently more rewarding?

  8. This article is spot-on. I left home around 24 because I couldn’t stand being around my Dad any longer, and despite my best efforts I’m still fighting to ‘grow up’ at age 32.

  9. One question remains: Why would the hopeless males in an age of insanity *want* to grow up and build a life when the other option; a live of weakness as a child is so much easier and quite frequently more rewarding?

    @Maldek

    On the surface, maybe. But if you’re in it for long-term happiness, then off course not man!

    Those guys are unhappy as hell: dependent on others, slaves to bitchy wives/GFs/bosses, constantly pushed around by “adult life”….plus they got no control over their own stuff. Think about it: it’s a shitty life to live in those “happiness” bubbles.

    Anyway, Pokemon Go is one of the dumbest stuff invented in a long time. Really, this is the idea of adult fun nowadays? To go around catching virtual fluffy animals like a 5 year old? Kudos to Nintendo for the marketing stunt, they hit the nail on the head with it, but no, thx. Too busy working, building my business and having sex with cute women, like a grown man should.

     

     

  10. Society is getting what society wanted.  Women and all of the beta cuck enablers have relentlessly drilled into heads of young men that they are not wanted, are not valued, and that men are just a bunch of child molesting rapists anyway.

    Men have an instinct to be provider/protectors.  Society has determined that it does not need this from men.  What do you think happens when society tells a segment of the population that their inborn instinct is not welcome?  THey rationally decide to opt out of society.

    I agree with the @Atlanta Man above who points out that economic opportunity is gone for young men.  Do you ever see special ed classes for young men urging them to go into STEM fields?  Never.  Do we see this for the young women and minorities?  of course.  This is just one example of 1000 different ways that society tells young men to go fuck off.

    Laws like affirmative consent.  Laws that make men criminals for having sex w/ a woman who has had even 1 drink, even if she is coming on to the man.  Laws like affirmative action for females.  These are society telling men that they are not welcome.

    So tell me how opting out of society’s expectations is not a rational thing to do?

    BTW, I am not a young man.  I have a career and plenty of money.  So your post is not hitting any personal hot spots for me.

     

  11. Maybe I missed this in the post, but do we know why this has happened and is still happening?  Is it that the parents are enabling them to do so?

    I’ve experienced it once myself…..an ex-boyfriend who was in his early thirties, who did have his own place with no roommates and never played video games, but his family would wash his laundry, clean his place, buy groceries for him, etc. I know they paid off at least $10k worth of credit card debt for him and if something in his place or car broke, he never had money to fix it and his parents would pay for those repairs……..and the list goes on and on. The most unbelievable part was that for all they did for him, you’d think he’d be grateful and kind to them, but he treated them meanly; had a nasty attitude towards them. They did love him very much and would do anything for him, but still, he needed to learn to do things for himself and be a man.

    It never affected me much because I have my own place and I only saw him about three days a week. Plus I didn’t care because it’s not like I would ever marry him and we did have fun for a few years, but still, all these things were VERY unattractive to me!

    The last straw was a few years later; he made a really ungrateful comment to me after I did a favor for him…..I would tell the story of what happened but it might be a dead giveaway just in case he ever saw this blog, (which I doubt, but still, I’ll just leave it unsaid).  Anyways I texted him that same afternoon to say I was never coming back again and that we were over.

    After that experience, I said I would never be apart of a man’s life again who was not independent.  I know we aren’t supposed to screen people, but I’m not looking just for sex; I was looking for a relationship, as well as someone I felt I could relate to and be close to the same place in life with.

  12. There are a couple of different levels to this obviously–one economic and one social.

    To the economic issues:

    @Atlanta Man

    The opportunities that men had in the past are gone. College is a fucking scam unless you are in STEM (and you still gotta compete with HB1 visas), the union factory jobs are gone , and the cost of living is higher than ever. Some of these men are simply making a cost benifit analysis and choosing video games, weed , online porn and drinking. If Ford was hiring straight out of high school paying $40 an hour and the economy was like it was in 1974 all these “man boys” would be gainfully employed-but that is the past.

    Assume you’re a young man who just graduated from college this May or June and you’re now starting to apply for jobs. Type in the zip code for any major U.S. city and look at the major job posting websites. You’re going to find plenty of jobs that pay minimum wage to sit at a desk all day being a receptionist or security guard, or bullshit sales jobs that pay mostly on commission where they lay everyone off every year when the sales numbers get low. That’s the reality of the American economy in 2016. The average private sector job only lasts 3 years and there are a disproportionate number of low paying and temp jobs compared to steady work that will pay a minimum of something like $35k per year so you can get your own place and survive.

    You also have companies and firms that now absolutely refuse to train anyone, so unless you’ve spent the last 10 years sitting at a desk doing something like bookkeeping, they’re not even going to talk to you. In practice this bars most people in their 20s to early 30s from the majority of decent jobs. Then on top of that you have HR departments staffed by young women addicted to adderall and their iphones who do very little work and are trained to hire automatons who have absolutely nothing derogatory or abnormal in their past. They will google people and bar them from employment if they find you retweeted something with the word “fuck” in it five years ago. I see why automation is such a threat now because companies literally want to hire people who are as close to machines as possible.

    To the social issues:

    It does seem that something like “binge watching” TV shows or sitting around playing video games all day is much more socially acceptable for adults than it was even 5 or 10 years ago. When I was a teenager, if you did stuff like that when you were beyond college age you were seen as a loser, now it’s just what everyone does. I really don’t understand it because I pretty much gave up on video games aside from a few minutes here or there for nostalgia purposes, and 99% of what is on television is so boring to me that it’s unwatchable. In today’s world people take their entertainment sources way too seriously.

  13. Also fuck women and their fucking anger, they wanted equal rights and they got them-welcome to the world of overwork, low pay and little recognition. When women entered the workforce where did they think the jobs would come from? They drove down wages by doubling the workforce-then came outsourcing.  I don’t blame the men who play video games, smoke weed, drink, fuck tinder dates and watch online porn in their mom’s basement-women need to adjust to the new normal, get their shit together and adjust their standards. Men have already adjusted to the new normal-Porn Hub, Call of Duty, purple haze and craft beers got them covered.

    Atlanta Man,

    But why is it mainly just the men?  How come us girls didn’t decide to just spend our days f*cking tinder dates, drinking and watching porn, TMZ and the Kardashians in our parents’ basements? How come we don’t opt-out of society?

    Maybe it is just a coincidence…….it had to be one gender or the other right?

    Women get hired before men to such a degree that they call our present economic situation a “mancession”

    Why don’t they just hire men and stop hiring women?  Maybe they hire women because they can pay a woman less to do the same job.  I guess more money/profits for a company is the bottom line; same reason they send our jobs to China like you said, because those people will do the same job for .15 cents an hour or whatever.

  14. Very true-I myself was wasting too much time on video games in my 20’s.  I pretty much stopped playing completely in my 30’s and focus on other pursuits like music.

    My one disagreement with you BD is that women mature at 23.  While they are better than when they were <23, I feel like most women are forever stuck in a teenage mentality.  Even the older ones still love to gossip, create drama, etc..

  15. @Bulma78

    Women can do what they want but unlike men women treat work like a social event, so they feel compelled to go. Men see work as a means to an end and they go only if it serves their needs. Women also get all the “make work” jobs-secretary,middle management, social media coordinator, liaisons, hostess, ect. Did you know more than 90 percent of HR positions are held by women? Human Resources is the biggest make work job ever, and is the barrier most men most overcome to gain employment. Office politics are toxic, and men are starting to just see that the stress is not worth it.

    On the subject of women watching Porn, smoking weed , and checking out from society-you are welcome to try, you will not be able to do it and will soon be on antidepressants. Women don’t understand that when men buy useless furniture, extra pillows, a house they cannot afford and engage in a consumer materialistic masturbation session to “keep up with the Joneses” , that is because the wife wants that bullshit. When a man buys a AR 15, a 1968 Shelby Mustang, 10 year old scotch and has the same furniture for the last ten years that’s what he wants-that is why advertising targets primarily women, they need to buy useless shit constantly.
    Advertisers tried to get men into dumb shit like fashion a few years ago, they told men to be “metrosexual “. The men asked why we should dress like homosexuals, and the advertisers said it would make women fuck us. When we asked the advertisers how they knew dressing like a homosexual would make women fuck us they said “because we will tell them what to like, fuck and how to act. We always do”. Men do what they want if it benefits them, women do what they are told.

  16. Maybe I missed this in the post, but do we know why this has happened and is still happening?  Is it that the parents are enabling them to do so?

    I wonder about the same thing.

  17. The funny thing about Pokemon go is that it’s actually increasing car accidents because there are people who are dumb enough to play it while driving. I hope that catching pikachoo is worth rear ending someone.

  18. wharr, you really got the MGTOWs to come out of the woodwork on this one BD!

    Well played sir.

  19. There’s a solution. Parents- steer your kids into technical fields.  That’s where the money is. My three kids are  engineers, and started making money within a year of graduating. If they can’t go to college, have them earn a skill or join the service.  It prevents them from wasting 10 years.

  20. I would say honestly that I am doing all of the things that a man needs to do (at least full out working on them), but I still feel I have some of those man boy tendencies like being really silly especially with women.

     

    Teasing a lot as well as not being completely masculine with people because I don’t want them to feel I don’t care about them. I find some of my wants and not taking responsibility cause I don’t feel like it all the time really is limiting. Not sure if this is a lack of clarity of my purpose or what. I know when I’m laser focused on my purpose nothing stops me and I’m more stoic.

     

    What do you recommend doing to kill this inner boy and step into the masculine full time?

  21. I think it’s more like 37 or 38, but like you said that number is an average and will be going up in the coming years.  I didn’t become a man until 38, even though I had kids and a 6 figure income I acted like a man-boy with too much TV, video games and drinking and not taking on the responsibilities of a man.  Part of it was due to looking at these “man” characters on TV and internalizing that’s just what’s funny; and how “men” acting like boys is just how “us stupid men” act.  That’s why I DESPISE tv so much now and what it does to a person who consumes too much of it.  I watch less than 1 hour of TV a week now.

  22. Are you a wizard or something?

    “YOU SHALL NOT PASS!”

    College is a fucking scam unless you are in STEM (and you still gotta compete with HB1 visas)

    It’s become largely a scam even with STEM.

    the cost of living is higher than ever

    Thanks to our excessive money printing and various other factors, yep.

    Some of these men are simply making a cost benifit analysis and choosing video games, weed , online porn and drinking.

    A few might be, but most of these men are not putting that much thought into it. Most of them are just immature children in a society that encourages immature children.

    When women entered the workforce where did they think the jobs would come from? They drove down wages by doubling the workforce-then came outsourcing.

    True, this is another reason for decreased real wages. Real wages have been declining since the early 70s, which is when women started to enter the workforce. Simple economics; when supply of workers increases, the cost of that item (wages) goes down.

    I don’t blame the men who play video games , smoke weed, drink, fuck tinder dates , and watch online porn in their mom’s basement

    I do. These men are fucking losers, by choice. It’s still possible to make a good income if you put your head down and focus on it for a few years. I see success stories all the time.

    women need to adjust to the new normal, get their shit together and adjust their standards

    Men and women need to adjust to the new normal. That doesn’t excuse what men are doing though.

    Why would the hopeless males in an age of insanity *want* to grow up and build a life when the other option; a live of weakness as a child is so much easier and quite frequently more rewarding?

    You’re half right. In our new left-wing, touchy-feely, welfare society, if you’re even slightly lazy you can have a lifestyle of $30k-$40K per year just sitting around and mooching off of your fellow taxpayers and your parents.

    Where you’re wrong is that this lifestyle is not more rewarding. It’s easier, but not more rewarding. You’ll never be a truly happy or fulfilled man living like this.

    Society is getting what society wanted

    Correct. I’ve been saying this for a long time. Failed economies, destroyed currencies, bankrupt welfare states, Donald Trump, Hillary Clinton…Western society has been asking for all of this crap for at least the last 30 years.

    Well, now you’ve got it, society. Hope you’re happy!

    So tell me how opting out of society’s expectations is not a rational thing to do?

    Not only is it rational, but it’s literally the only rational option left. (Since old school methods for affecting social change such as voting for certain people, writing your congressman, organizing mass protests, etc, none of these things work any more.)

    do we know why this has happened and is still happening?

    Yes. It was just explained above by various comments including this one.

    Is it that the parents are enabling them to do so?

    That’s another reason, yes, as I explain here.

    My one disagreement with you BD is that women mature at 23.  While they are better than when they were <23, I feel like most women are forever stuck in a teenage mentality.  Even the older ones still love to gossip, create drama, etc..

    We don’t disagree. I didn’t say women suddenly become rational at age 23. I said they stop with the really insane teenage behaviors such as constantly blowing their money, fucking mass numbers of guys without using condoms, being unable to hold a job for more than a few months, etc.

  23. Atlanta Man, Vitriol, Maldek, Oh Yes, MattyIce, POB and Crab Rangoon gave responses that I would have above so I won’t go over them. Read and re-read them and let that sink into your head. Men aren’t taught to grow up when they are boys and young men so they don’t. There often isn’t a father or father figure to teach them how due to the bastardy rates and divorce rates. Women are taught to grow up as girls and young women because they at least have someone usually their mother to model their behavior even if the model is poor. Poor models are usually but not always better than no models, and a higher percentage of men have poor and no models in comparison to women.

    That leads me to my next point. A higher percentage of jerk boys/ men and immature boys and men get women to ejaculate their penises especially when they are teenage girls and young women. Why would boys or men change if that is what you women are rewarding? Why would men change to become responsible when you ladies don’t reward it when the boys and men are younger and quite often punish or ignore it? This leads to a pattern of immature and jerk behavior which is difficult to break and won’t be broken if broken at all until these men are older.

    My last point is that men don’t mature faster is not only due to economic reasons which commenters above made, but due to marriage market  place reasons too. Why mature to become a husband and father when you don’t have to do so? In fact getting married and becoming a father is at best ignored and at worst punished. Actually the over all sexual market place of which the marriage market place is a subsidiary at best ignores such immature jerk and immature behavior among teenage and 20 something men and quite often worse it rewards and fails to punish it. You get what you pay for or what you reward and punish. Nice and responsible men don’t get rewarded when they are in their teenage and 20 something years and are at best ignored and at worst punished. Men either respond by becoming a charming jerkboy women love to have sex with and ejaculate as Heartiste would say or they give up in disgust and go MGTOW. Men can and do on average live on less than women do. The number one thing heterosexual men care about is women having sex with them which leads to the next statement below. Heterosexual teenage boys, young men as well as middle aged and older men are only responding to incentive and disincentives you ladies give them. It’s the world you wanted, and now you have it, ladies and gentlemen.

  24. Nice post, and I can’t really disagree with it. But I think you are rather biased given your age and having been through marriage and children. I wonder how you would’ve reacted if you witnessed the behavior of women and a shitty economy having being born twenty years later.
    Atlanta hit the nail on the head with his comments. Guys don’t want to improve themselves for sub par women; juice isn’t worth the squeeze and all that jazz. This is good for guys like you and others who will exploit the ever increasing sugar baby market, which Rollo did a nice job of describing recently in a post of his.

  25. I think you are rather biased given your age and having been through marriage and children. I wonder how you would’ve reacted if you witnessed the behavior of women and a shitty economy having being born twenty years later.

    Atlanta hit the nail on the head with his comments. Guys don’t want to improve themselves for sub par women; juice isn’t worth the squeeze and all that jazz. This is good for guys like you and others who will exploit the ever increasing sugar baby market, which Rollo did a nice job of describing recently in a post of his.

    1. I have a very high-quality girlfriend (OLTR), more than qualified for a long-term relationship, right now, so it still can be done. This “all women suck” thing is untrue.

    2. I’m not a player going around and banging lots of random chicks like you’re suggesting (and if you weren’t suggesting this then I apologize). Nor do I do sugar daddy game (I dabbled in it a few times). I only do long-term (nonmono) relationships, which is exactly why I stopped doing sugar daddy game, since sugar daddy game is not conducive for long-term relationships at all, as I’ve explained several times.

    Yes, things suck for the modern day man, but let’s not go overboard here gentlemen. The world is still full of very high-quality women, and you’ll find them as long as you man up and put in the numbers.

    Going full MGTOW, and throwing your arms up in the air while saying there are “no good women anymore” is not accurate nor a solution that will make you happy.

  26. This harkens back to Rollo’s SMV posts. Women biologically have to grow up and find a responsible beta bank account while men don’t have the same biological imperative.

    I normally agree with most of BD’s premises and have adopted many of his philosophies to great success. That being said, I wholeheartedly disagree that these girls are growing up at 23.

    I’m 30/M/well employed and there are a majority of girls even my age and into mid-30s playing “strong independent career woman RAWR!!!” by day and getting drunk and riding the carousel by night. Then running Kardashian marathons on Saturdays and mimosa binges on Sundays. All the while bemoaning the lack of available quality men but refusing to turn the lens around for some introspection.

    When society destroys all semblance of family structures, men have no incentive to do better since they are naturally minimalistic.

  27. @Black Dragon

    I am 40 now and a responsible adult. I “grew up” when I was 24 because it felt odd to see my college classmates getting jobs, going to Law and Medical School and generally moving forward with their lives while I was still partying and half assing my way through college. I graduated in 2000 and began moving forward career wise. I finished law school just in time for the recession.

    Fast forward to now and I graduated medical school this Past December with a MD/PhD and I am in a good relationship with a sweet Russian girl. I mention this so I can make 2 points.

    1) I am not a risk taker like you-I cannot build an income from scratch , work hard for years to build an audience/client base , and become successful- You are successful, built it yourself , and took the risks nessasary to do it. Most guys are like me-show us a realistic path to success we will take it. Most men are not like you-make your own way with no guarantees, and work hard as hell with no safety net if it does not work out. When Most men see graduates working at Starbucks they do the math and choose to check out. Most men need guarantees. I went to medical school after law school for the guarantee of reasonable income.

    2) American women of the current generation are not worth the effort and they do not respect men who do the right thing. The Russian girl I am currently dating genuinely respects me for working hard and I can be nice to her. With her I can immediately respond to Text messages, tell her she is pretty, and just be myself. Before her I was dating younger American women and I had to pretend to be a criminal or a mercenary(I am dead serious) and treat them like shit.

    I totally understand why these young guys checked out on society, if I had been born a decade later I would probably have checked out too. I went to school with a lot of guys in their 20s who where all going to be doctors , great providers, and did everything right- none of them could get laid easily, and many just struggled to get a date. Meanwhile lazy do nothing men are getting laid left and right, where is the motivation to do for society if you cannot get a date?

  28. I wholeheartedly disagree that these girls are growing up at 23.

    For the second time, and this is the last time I’m saying this, I’m not saying that at age 23 women become the masculine definition of what an adult should look like. Women never do that. I’m staying they stop the stupid teenager shit at around age 23 and start cleaning up their act in terms of income and general craziness.

    You yourself confirmed this when you said that mid-30s women have strong careers/jobs. 21 year-old girls do not have this. They aren’t even capable of it.

  29. I agree with the main thrust of your post 100%.

    A couple facts are wrong though, that should probably change for future reference to help the credibility along:

    ‘Most’ women do not stop drinking at 23, or move to once or twice a year. A very good amount, especially in urban centers, drink all. the. fucking. time. To age 30, and beyond age 30. A LOT. The craft beer cultural phenomenon and wine and liquor is in FULL BORE. Now, do they drink to EXCESS? No. Most professional white collar women will have one drink, or two, or three for the real surly ones. And end it there. Stark contrast to their male coworkers who will hammer back 6 in one night and get shit-faced. Corporate women will drink actually quite a bit, as it’s ubiqutious as events, dates, 5ks, etc.

     

    The other thing you mentioned is that the average male, Skeeter, who plays video games at age 30 is making about $30k a year. Eh, if he has a useless college degree, it’s probably closer to $40-$50k if he’s age 30, on average. I mean check median incomes for a 30 year old male in the US. He’s still a juvenile retard but he’s not exactly living in poverty (nor the life of riley).

  30. Guys continue to be stuck on gender miopia to realize women change all the time. Dudes, remember, we change once or twice in our lifetime (if that much)…on the other hand women are not static: they go through “phases”.

    I agree 100% that girls are still teens in their early 20s. Unless they already have kids (which on some cases minimize the crazy behavior), they’re exactly as BD described. Once they “grow up”, they start to get some of their shit together, ASD kicks in (and steadily grows), but it does not prevent them to revert back to that same phase later in life. Tip: think about all the cougars riding a mini cock-carousel of younger guys.

    I also agree that women in their mid to late 30s are shittiest as ever (exceptions aside). Its really hard to stand them nowadays. Most are spoiled little brats still living with their parents and waiting for a white night (cough…beta….cough) to come to the rescue…or are just playing the “independent” game described by @OCredpill. Really a shame because some of them are smoking hot and could be really cool to have a relationship with.

    My take is we as men don’t need any “incentive” to grow up. Life itself will put huge challenges on our path (these days more than ever). But once we conquer them, that’s when the fun begins: because new challenges will come from within. Accomplishing them can give us a primal satisfaction most men will never feel.

    I’ll happily make that trade with with any Peter Pans out there.

  31. I cannot build an income from scratch , work hard for years to build an audience/client base , and become successful

    Yes you can. No one is putting a gun to your head forcing you to be average or be a loser.

    You really need two work on your self esteem.

    Most men are not like you-make your own way with no guarantees, and work hard as hell with no safety net if it does not work out.

    More ridiculous excuses. You can start your business on the side while working full time. There’s your safety net. That’s exactly what I did.

    No one is telling you to quit your job with no income and no solid prospects.

    When Most men see graduates working at Starbucks they do the math and choose to check out.

    No, a lazy loser chooses this. Instead, a rational person sees college grads working at Starbucks and says, “Clearly a corporate job will never make me rich. I’d better do something else, like start working on my own business.”

    When I was in my early 20s, back 20 years ago in the early 1990s, most of my buddies were stupid enough to go to college too, and most of them ended up in shit jobs too, so this is nothing new (though I agree it’s worse now). I realized very quckly that having a job would never make me happy or successful, so I looked for different avenues. I didn’t say, “Oh shit. I guess I’m fucked for life.” This isn’t rocket science.

    American women of the current generation are not worth the effort and they do not respect men who do the right thing.

    I already addressed that in comments above. This will be the last time I say this in this thread: Just because Western women are not as good as they used to be, doesn’t mean there are zero good Western women in the world. Any decent guy can find such a woman as long as he puts in the numbers and doesn’t act like a pussy, something 98% of men have the ability to do if they put the effort in to do so.

    And as I said in the blog post, if your answer is, “I’m too lazy to do that,” then you’re proving my entire point about how lazy and weak men have become, and yeah, you really are fucked for life.

    I totally understand why these young guys checked out on society

    This blog post is not about men who have checked out on society. (I myself recommend that all men detach from the system as much as possible.) This blog post is about grown men acting like children or teenagers.

    Meanwhile lazy do nothing men are getting laid left and right, where is the motivation to do for society if you cannot get a date?

    I’m not sure what planet you live on, but lazy men are not getting laid left and right. Men getting laid left and right are men working very hard in the women side of their lives, just like I was doing several years ago. The lazy guy sitting on the couch all day playing Call of Duty and eating Hot Pockets is not “getting laid left and right.”

    With men having such warped attitudes like yours, no wonder Western Civ is screwed.

  32. Krauser talked in Balls Deep about how the rites of passage of men just don’t exist in our culture anymore.

     

  33. BD- I was going by the loose definition you were using, the “23-ish” age, not a hard 23 and I absolutely agree with your comment about women never being “adult” by the masculine definition.

    I was suggesting that the immature teenager actions do not differ so much between these girls of the pre-23-ish age and their late 20s sisters or the guys of similar age ranges. The girls may tone down a bit on the completey inane girltalk but not much on the hedonism. The guys actions are merely the manifestation of their immaturity in a different form from the girls relationship driven ones.

    In any case, for the girls who play “independent,” a good portion will drop out of the workforce completely when (if?) they have kids anyway so it doesn’t really matter if they play grown up for a few years. These guys figure why bother changing myself if I’m happy.

    Like johnny said, I think a lot of these guys have craft suds and Tinder and do not see a realistic family occuring in their near future so they don’t bother trying to improve themselves and instead live with their status quo. I don’t sympathize with this strategy but I can understand why they do it.

    Off topic- I want to say thanks BD, your essays have helped me immensely. Outcome Independence has been one of the most powerful tools I have ever learned. You are doing great work here and I refer my friends and family to your articles regularly.

  34. Guys, this blog is for older men dating younger women. Most of us should be able to validate the article by simply looking back on recent dating experience.

    If anything, this post reminded me of one of my go-to answers for dealing with the question, “why do you like dating younger women?”. The answer:

    “The chemistry works better. Women grow up in their 20s. Men don’t grow up until their 30s”.

    Most women will laugh and agree with this statement. Try it on your next first date, and tell me how it goes.

    I am not a risk taker like you-I cannot build an income from scratch , work hard for years to build an audience/client base , and become successful

    Everyone can do it. All of the tools and infrastructure are there to run a low-overhead business in any industry. The problem is that most people do it the wrong way, building a solution before validating a real problem. Or worse, trying to grow their business before establishing a predictable, repeatable business model at small scale.

    “I am not a risk-taker” is simply another way of saying you’re compromising freedom for security. You’re still taking a risk, you’re just risking something else.

    Parents- steer your kids into technical fields.  That’s where the money is.

    This is SP talking. It’s a good start for kids coming out of college, but it’s not a good long-term solution. Engineers are seen as workhorse grunts no matter how senior or experienced they are (ask me how I know), and “good money” is relative. An engineer will make more than a car mechanic, but it’s not even close to what an investment banker earns. Not to mention, the typical RN earns about the same as a senior engineer (and if you factor in the salary/overtime situation, many RNs make more per hour).

    The media glorifies engineering careers because we are in a tech boom. And the guys who really DO have good money, i.e. investors, need more grunts to execute their initiatives. This is why most engineers start considering startups/entrepreneurship around 26-28, when they realize they’ve already hit the ceiling (and don’t want to go into management).

  35. “Back when I was 20,” they say, “I had a house, job, wife, two kids, paid my bills, and was responsible.…

    A wife that would at least keep up the appearance of keeping her vows, a house that he could reasonably expect to keep and to live in for the rest of his life, and kids that took his name and that he would be there to raise.

    It’s that last one that matters most. It isn’t years that age a man, it’s responsibility; and for most men that means being a father. Not just a name on a birth certificate.

     

  36. But why is it mainly just the men?  How come us girls didn’t decide to just spend our days f*cking tinder dates, drinking and watching porn, TMZ and the Kardashians in our parents’ basements? How come we don’t opt-out of society?

    Biology. The age at which women become adults is around when their pelvic ligaments start to  freeze up.

    Why don’t they just hire men and stop hiring women?  Maybe they hire women because they can pay a woman less to do the same job.

    No, “they” cannot do that. “They” pay women the same – if not slightly more – for the same job. It’s the law.

  37. While I agree that this is a GENERAL trend, it is not hard to stand out. I myself am ony 25 and making $50.000+, have lived on my own since I was 20 and don’t engage in life-wasting activities more often than I should (Thank you BD!)

    However, the general stance of my friends and sorroundings is that it is OK for young people to rely on government assistance and to educate themselves until they are 30+.

    This, of course, makes it even better living the alpha 2.0 lifestyle (or as close to it as possible) as you stand even more easily out from everyone. And the general message that you hear from girls when you already have a mission and a  well-planned future ahead of you: “I have never met anyone who has their life completely under control and who knows what they want, and more importantly, how to achieve it.”

    So the article holds true, and the exceptions confirm the article rather than disprove it.

  38. To any man feeling depressed, disillusioned with the world, suicidal, or trapped, please watch this 4 minute video and understand that you are not in this alone and that you can overcome these institutional obstacles.

    But why is it mainly just the men?  How come us girls didn’t decide to just spend our days f*cking tinder dates, drinking and watching porn, TMZ and the Kardashians in our parents’ basements? How come we don’t opt-out of society?

    Bulma78: If you want an answer to your above questions, watch this 4 minute video as well:

  39. This post really hit home for me; I couldn’t agree more.

    And up until recently, I was one of these loser men.

    Actually, I’m still struggling. However, after years of being a pussy and woosing-out on even trying, thinking it all to be too hard, I’ve committed myself to growing up and working my ass off.

    Problem is, I’ve a shitty job and not really sure how to go about creating something on the side as is recommended here (and elsewhere). I’m not an entrepreneur by nature but I’m ready and willing to work my ass off – any suggestions on where to look for guidance on how to get going?

  40. I gotta comment on this. I find some of the responses of you guys really depressing. What BD didn’t really define was what it means to be mature. I’ll give my opinion in brief — to be mature is to own your own life. To be mature is to recognize that you are where you are because of your choices. To be mature is to recognize the simple fact that everything in your life, good or bad, is your fault.

    Now don’t get me wrong there are some exceptions to that, and some situations are harder than others. But good god guys, we have SO many advantages today that men didn’t have fifty years ago. Just one example — the Internet. It has transformed the ability of people to make something of themselves.

    For example, five years ago there was no Uber. Now a guy can get a decent car for not much money, and live in the gig economy to give himself space to build his empire. (BTW, if you didn’t notice that is another advantage guys today have. Cars, even older cars are much better, much more reliable, resist rust and damage etc. etc. than cars 50 years ago.) It is low hanging fruit. Make a blog with interesting material. Start a business doing landscaping and use the Internet as a marketing tool that, fifty years ago, Exon Mobile couldn’t have dreamed of.

    When I hear people complaining about factory jobs, and H1Bs, and minimum wage, and competition in the job market what I hear is people who want to live their lives off others. Why the hell would you want to work in a factory where your hours are set by someone else, your wages set by someone else, even the physical movements you do are set by someone else. You have almost no power in that situation, so why the hell would you do it? Join a union and you have even LESS control, since you give it over to the union. Or at least why would you not do it for as short a time as possible while you used the rest of your time to make something you own?

    One hundred years ago that was impossible because you had to work 16 hours a day, six days a week. Fifty years ago it was WAY hard because you had to fight the culture and legal system that made it hard for people to start their own businesses. Today, it is served up on a plate. A few clicks and you have a massive marketing tool, and a massive research tool at your fingertips.

    As for women, yes there are lots of mediocre women in the world, but there are also lots of amazing women too. Let the loser boys date the drama chicks. It is like a freaking walk in the park these days compared to fifty years ago. Today you have Internet dating to make it EASY to meet HUNDREDS of women, and the Internet is BRISTLING with information on how to be successful with these women. There is NO excuse.

    So I say man up guys. Take responsibility for your lives. Own your own future. Good god don’t cede that kind of control to Donald Trump or Hillary Clinton or whomever you expect to fix your life. If you can build a decent financial base you can weather a lot more storms than the poor schmuck who just did what his boss told him to do.

    Is it hard? Is it time consuming? does it take focus and skill? Does it take dedication? No more of those things that it takes to become a level 80 elf in some stupid fantasy world.

     

     

  41. As a man just learning from the Black Dragon School of Dating, in his mid-thirties , and wanting to bang women in her mid twenties, I approve this message!

  42. @Bulma:

    But why is it mainly just the men?  How come us girls didn’t decide to just spend our days f*cking tinder dates, drinking and watching porn, TMZ and the Kardashians in our parents’ basements? How come we don’t opt-out of society?

    In addition to the video I posted, understand that female losers exist in roughly equal proportion, but they are less conspicuous because men take care of them financially. But if a man wants to be a loser, he must live in his parent’s basement and be very noticeable about it because he can’t trade sex for money.

    But female losers who are the equivalent of him are all around you:

    1. Female millionaires and billionaires who got their money by marrying and divorcing rich manginas

    2. Typical conservative/religious housewives

    3. Women who go to sugar daddy websites.

    4. Women who are currently at the top of our society’s financial and social status hierarchies.

    All the above women are the female equivalent of male losers who live in their parent’s basements, smoke weed, and play video games all day! They just have good PR because they trade sexual favors for money and get powerful beta males to take care of them, whereas male losers have to rely on their parents!

    Why don’t they just hire men and stop hiring women?

    Because if they were to stop hiring women, feminists would get their beta male slaves to pour gasoline all over themselves and light themselves on fire in protest “to stand against misogyny.” The public backlash would be tremendous!

    Besides, I want women to have jobs. Sexual liberation is impossible without a gender neutral economy, as I don’t want a parasite draining my bank account or have a woman’s sexual urges take a back seat to her financial necessities. Women have no business turning themselves into men’s parasites like the female losers described above.

    Maybe they hire women because they can pay a woman less to do the same job.  I guess more money/profits for a company is the bottom line; same reason they send our jobs to China like you said, because those people will do the same job for .15 cents an hour or whatever.

    Complete feminist garbage!

    Women do NOT get paid less than men. That is against the law, as it violates the Civil Rights Act of 1964 which prohibits sex and gender discrimination in the workplace of any kind. The so called “gender wage gap” is a myth concocted by the lesbian, the fat, and the blue haired.

    Anyone who believes in the wage gap doesn’t know the difference between wages and earnings:

    A wage is what you get paid per hour. Your earnings are what you make after, for example, working a certain amount of hours per week/month/year.

    The reason there is an earnings gap between men and women is because of the different life choices women make which motivate them to work less hours, take longer vacations, go on maternity leave, call in sick more often, and in general balance the necessities of their professional lives with happiness in their personal lives. Many women even choose to quit their jobs, or work only part time after having kids, or find a beta loser who will provide her with the lifestyle she wants.

    So if you add up all the hours men work per year and all the hours women work per year and then perform kindergarten math, you’ll come up with 75 cents for every dollar a man makes or whatever. But this doesn’t take into account that women don’t kill themselves at the office for 80 hours per week.

    There are three reasons women don’t work as hard as men:

    1. They value their happiness more than men do and balance the professional with the personal (something I wish men would learn to do as well).

    2. They’re not motivated to because beta male losers give them money (something I wish would stop).

    3. They are not pressured by male gold diggers to make money, or threatened to have sex withheld from them if they don’t make six figures (something I wish female gold diggers would stop doing to men).

    Eliminate the above three and you eliminate the earnings gap!

  43. Quintus Curtius just did a podcast where a reader asked him about this very topic, even using the term “Childification”.

    Posted today too. Weird coincidence

  44. As a 24 year old living at home thank you for posting this. I recently bought your book as well as maximum achievement by Brian tracy and am working towards moving out of the house etc. So far I’m seeing some good results, and I’m on the cusp of bring my skill set/income to places I’ve never been ever before. It seems like there’s always something coming out for me to spend my time/money on and steer me away from my goals. Im thinking I should opt out of these music festivals and comic conventions that I’ve been very enticed by (raver chicks & music scenes) in favor of moving out, knocking out my smaller debts, and having the chance to fund MY music. The other missing piece seems to be the side hustle. Im excited to have the pick of the litter as everyone is childified.

    I hope to join your SMIC when I have money and am working towards being self employed

    Cheers

  45. @OCRedpill:

    I’m 30/M/well employed and there are a majority of girls even my age and into mid-30s playing “strong independent career woman RAWR!!!” by day and getting drunk and riding the carousel by night.

    In other words, they are responsible business women who are gainfully employed with full time jobs by day, and have fun and enjoy life at night, just like all of us here do. What’s the problem? We ride the “pussy carousel.” Do you have a problem with that?

    Then running Kardashian marathons on Saturdays and mimosa binges on Sundays. All the while bemoaning the lack of available quality men but refusing to turn the lens around for some introspection.

    And if they were to succumb to introspection, what would they do differently? These are women with full time jobs, yes? What, in your mind, are they doing wrong that they can’t find a quality man?

    When society destroys all semblance of family structures, men have no incentive to do better since they are naturally minimalistic.

    The poly community has a good sense of family AND community. There are multiple ways to structure a family.

    I was suggesting that the immature teenager actions do not differ so much between these girls of the pre-23-ish age and their late 20s sisters or the guys of similar age ranges. The girls may tone down a bit on the completey inane girltalk but not much on the hedonism.

    So you have a problem with hedonism? Even while you’re on a blog which promotes it for both men and women? Why? You seem to have some cognitive dissonance.

    This is slut shaming dude! Pure and simple.

     

  46. @POB:

    Once they “grow up”, they start to get some of their shit together, ASD kicks in (and steadily grows), but it does not prevent them to revert back to that same phase later in life. Tip: think about all the cougars riding a mini cock-carousel of younger guys.

    Unless I’m reading you wrong, you seem to equate getting their shit together with rising ASD, thus implying that becoming cougars and “riding a mini-cock carousel” is somehow childish and a real adult woman is a prude. I hope you didn’t mean it like this.

    just playing the “independent” game described by @OCredpill.

    I don’t get this. How is being responsible, gainfully employed, financially independent, and with your own place a “game” that women play? It’s like some of you guys are trashing women for being gold diggers relying on betas (which I agree with you guys on), while also trashing them for being independent, making their own money, having a full time job, and enjoying life (which I disagree with you guys on).

    It’s as if she is damned if she does and damned if she doesn’t with some of you. What’s wrong with a woman making her own money like a responsible adult and enjoying her sexuality??? That’s precisely what we want!!!

    Really a shame because some of them are smoking hot and could be really cool to have a relationship with.

    Can’t you have a relationship with them now? Why not?

    Let’s not become the male equivalent of gold diggers demanding that a woman make six figures before we fuck her, lol! Then again, that wouldn’t satisfy some of you either because then you’d just be trashing her for being independent and enjoying life. It’s weird to trash women for doing what us successful men do!

     

  47. Great guidelines, and I just want to add to the subtleties of this post, that someone may find useful one day:

    (But this might piss off a lot of people)

    If you are serious about establishing yourself as being as independent from the system as possible, then if circumstances allow (as in if you are in good terms with your family and they are supportive and respect you), I recommend that you DO move back home with your parents.

    Building a business, and/or developing the skills necessary to start a business in a specific field of your choosing, can take YEARS.

    YEARS.

    Moving back home with your parents to do this, has the added benefit of being practice for you to not give a shit.

    Having a job on the side can be distracting, especially if there is a problem in your industry that you do not care to solve, a hole in their workflow that you do not care to fill, aka you want to do something else unrelated.

    If you can, save as much as you can to last you, like, 5 years, living with your parents. So to pay rent, for better internet, your groceries, your equipment, to cover anything and everything you need. (Escorts)

    The next best course of action, after living with your parents, is to move into a studio and sell your car and buy a shitty used one. Shit like that.

    Also, if you MUST play videogames, don’t buy a console. Buy a good fucking computer because at least you can use it to learn programming languages, whatever skills you need, and develop your business. Also get a stand-up desk and a good chair (preferably something that makes you activate your muscles, and not a super comfy chair that will encourage your glutes to atrophy). And do your best not to fucking buy massively-multiplayer games. Buy ones that are on sale, or CDKeys for cheap — games that you can pause, save and load later.

    Unlike BD, I still take time off specifically to marathon select games. Marathoning them for three days straight usually ends up with me getting bored of them and never touching them ever again.

    And if you’re anything like me, you can use your appreciation for videogames and channel it for your business. As in, for example, you can create your own videogames, your own programs, plugins. I’m in the entertainment industry, so I follow the latest CG FX technologies. There was this one guy who recently made 4+ million dollars coding a tiny “shitty-looking” game all by himself. It took him FOUR YEARS though. But he taught himself how to code all of it.

    Although it is generally seen as childish to play videogames, you cannot deny that it’s becoming a very large and profitable industry. There is money, and more importantly FINANCIAL INDEPENDENCE that can be made through this avenue.

    Also, many of the technologies that go into videogames also go into film.

    So, take this for what you will. Computers are still relatively new. And they’re only getting powerful enough to handle making shit look realistic.

    What I’m saying is, at the very least, channel your passion for “childish” things in ways that can support you.

    Don’t just play videogames. Make Them.

  48. Also, I’ve talked to many of those Starbucks workers, juice-bar workers, waitresses, and quite a few of them move from all across the country, all by themselves, just for the chance of making it big here in LA. Some of these folks majored in business, psychology, or whatever useless shit like that (meaning they have student loans to pay off), and want to be actors, actresses, musicians, artists, comedians…

    Almost every time, I think to myself, “why did you come all the way here to do something you can go do at home, with far less financial stress, where you’re from? You have the fucking Internet now. YouTube. Soundcloud. Vimeo. What the fuck are you guys doing?”

    People make it SO FUCKING HARD for themselves. So UNNECESSARILY fucking hard. I say, suck it up, let people think you’re a fucking loser by living with your parents, so long as you’re working towards something.

     

  49. @Duke:

    This is good for guys like you and others who will exploit the ever increasing sugar baby market,

    Um…..what?

    Not only do guys like BD and myself NOT exploit the sugar baby market, but guys like me condemn it and condemn all women who have sex for non-sexual reasons as despicable.

    We don’t give women a single penny! My payment for her pussy is my dick! End of!

  50. @Atlanta Man:

    Fast forward to now and I graduated medical school this Past December with a MD/PhD and I am in a good relationship with a sweet Russian girl.

    Oh boy! Russian huh? And you’re a doctor eh? Fuck! How’s her money?

    American women of the current generation are not worth the effort and they do not respect men who do the right thing.

    This has been the opposite of my experience. The problem is that lots of men who “do the right thing” are beta nerds, whereas lots of men who don’t are masculine alphas. But if you’re a masculine alpha who also does the right thing, that will make you the perfect man!

    The Russian girl I am currently dating genuinely respects me for working hard

    LOL! Yeah, I bet she does! Cough, cough………so….um……how’s her money?

    and I can be nice to her. With her I can immediately respond to Text messages, tell her she is pretty, and just be myself.

    Uh huh. So you’re doing the beta thing with her. Are you…..by any chance……providing her with any materialistic resources?

    Before her I was dating younger American women and I had to pretend to be a criminal or a mercenary(I am dead serious) and treat them like shit.

    Masculine men are associated sometimes with irresponsibility because women are sexually attracted to rebels and mavericks. But, like I said, if you can be a responsible man AND give them the masculinity they crave, they will love you for it. The self made millionaire nerd isn’t rejected because of his stability and “doing the right thing.” He’s rejected because he’s an anti-masculine nerd (except by gold diggers who use him for money).

    I totally understand why these young guys checked out on society, if I had been born a decade later I would probably have checked out too. I went to school with a lot of guys in their 20s who where all going to be doctors , great providers, and did everything right- none of them could get laid easily, and many just struggled to get a date. Meanwhile lazy do nothing men are getting laid left and right, where is the motivation to do for society if you cannot get a date?

    That’s because those lazy men were at least masculine and charming, whereas the conformist men who “did everything right” were anti-charming geeks! Again, it’s not “doing everything right” that is a turn off. It’s being a nerd and a dweeb in the process that causes women to gravitate to the poverty stricken jerks, because those rebels at least have what those women crave (masculinity), even if an unfortunate side effect of these men’s masculine rebellion is them being poverty stricken losers.

    This precisely proves that not all women are gold diggers! I wouldn’t tell the nerds to stop working on their PHDs. I’d tell them to stop being nerds!

  51. @Marsupial:

    A wife that would at least keep up the appearance of keeping her vows,

    I’m actually working on this. Some of the wives that I have slept with have sincerely asked me for tips about how they can best keep up the appearance of keeping their vows, so as to better ensure that they won’t get caught.

    I’ve given married women multiple strategies, including telling the husband a fake story about getting approached by a man and saying “no I’m married.” Many women struggle to keep up appearances of faithfulness because some of them aren’t good actresses, and they feel bad about this because they don’t want to hurt their husbands.

    So I try to do everything I can to minimize their chances of getting caught by helping them appear to be the innocent Disney princesses their husbands think they married. The beta husband who chose the blue pill doesn’t deserve, and wouldn’t be able to handle, the pain of red pill truth, so it really is our moral responsibility to make sure he stays in the dark, and in my experience, most married women have accepted this moral responsibility and want to keep up appearances as best as possible.

    Overall, these are very good, kind, and compassionate women.

  52. Ah look another “man up” post – this looks like it could have been written by a feminist. Let me provide a few counterpoints:

    – Women do not “grow up” faster than men. 28-year-old women are definitely not more “mature” than 28-year-old men. Maybe fewer of them live with their parents, but that’s because they live with their husbands and boyfriends instead. It makes no sense to compare young women to young men in terms of living with parents as a measure of independence. Also, you’re assuming these 20-somethings who play video games are less likely to be holding down a job than the equivalent aged woman, which in my experience is patently untrue; many of them work as software engineers or similar jobs, and can more or less pay their way; they just live minimalistic lifestyles. So yes, men these days could definitely “man up,” but presenting women as role models for them, pretending women have life all figured out and it’s all men’s fault they suck, or passing this off as some “rah rah rah grrl power” shit is just silly.

    -In my experience, 25-33 year old women typically behave much like their younger counterparts. They still hang out with their friends at bars, like to buy expensive shit from malls, and get supported by slightly older successful men. They certainly don’t strike me as having any financial sense.

    I will concede that men today are less traditionally masculine than in the past. They don’t know how to lead, they get emotional easily, and they generally want to make enough money to support just themselves (rather than a family). Also they are more likely to be dependent on others (though this also applies to women, probably even more so). However, women today are also very unfeminine: they refuse to cook and clean, want to control the relationship, file for divorce at the drop of a hat, and generally treat men like shit.

    I find it a little weird that you’re parroting standard textbook feminist grrl-power bs.

  53. I’m 34. Sounds about right.

    Basic problem is that while women are born (men want youth and beauty from them, things which come on their own so long as they are not fat), men are built. We have to learn, from mentors or harsh experience, what a man is and how to be one. In this age and culture, we have few to no mentors and often have to be self-taught.

  54. This article is a little…odd.  I do not disagree with the argument presented but we know the following:

    1.  Marriage and family is a scam today and thus there is no motivation to work hard to value signal to women.

    2. Women spread their legs for PUAs and guys that run game not beta providers.  I would ask those women who complain about child-men, ” If that isn’t the kind of man you want then why do you sleep with them?”

    Cheers

     

  55. @Jack in the Box

    The Russian girl is a lawyer and currently makes more than me, I will surpass her in roughly two years. Medical School does not mean money, being a doctor with a DEA number does- I will be interested to see how my classmates end up relationship wise. I hope they don’t marry the first chick they fuck during residency, that happens a lot from what I hear.

  56. @Atlanta Man says
    > The Russian girl is a lawyer and currently makes more than me,

    Yes, Jack in the box, that was a totally cheap shot. Russian women are quite lovely in my experience, they have that Slavic genetics and a culture that very much inculcates femininity into them. I’ve met many Russian women, and dated one, and she was simply spectacular in every way.

    I guess you are implying that she is a green card bride. But you do so on little information, and I might add I see nothing wrong with that type of transaction anyway. As long as the guy remains Alpha these sorts of things work well, I hear. Of course if it is a stereotypical old dude with no game, and a super hot chick, of course it’ll be a disaster, but the method of initial meeting isn’t the cause of that.

    > Medical School does not mean money, being a doctor with a DEA number does

    In regards to being a doctor, I’d be worried if I were you (assuming you are in the United States, which seems a reasonable assumption given your user name.) If I were I doctor, which I’m not, I’d be doing everything I could to get out of mainstream medicine. And by mainstream I mean working for insurance company paid bills, or worse, working for medicare/medicaid paid bills.

    It is going to become more and more of a nightmare. I’d get some experience under my belt and then get out of that into concierge medicine, or specialized no insurance centers, or working for the medical industry. Frankly, I’d move my ass to Panama and work down there instead. You’d be a HUGE hit assuming you know what you are doing.

    It used to be doctors set up their own little practices and did very well for themselves. Now, from what I have seen they are sucked up into mega conglomerates and squeezed on every side on cost and on overwhelmingly stupid bureaucracy. I have a friend who is a doctor and ten years ago was a happy businessman doing very well, until he got crushed under the weight of medicare. The result, he had to merge his practice into a big conglomerate and he now feels like he is little more than the factory worker I mentioned before.

    I’m not a doctor, so I’d be interested to hear what your plans are. You have amazing value to offer, and people would readily trade it for money, but it’ll all be lost in the fog of government regulation if you aren’t careful.

  57. It’s still possible to make a good income if you put your head down and focus on it for a few years

    Yes, it is. But why would a guy in his 20s do that anymore?

  58. I find some of the responses of you guys really depressing.

    So do I. It’s a shit show in here.

    To you more angry, depressed, or right-wingish guys:

    1. Just because women suck doesn’t mean men don’t suck too. Just because the other “team” is fucking things up badly doesn’t mean your “team” is doing everything right and should never be criticized.

    Yes, women are real problems today. I have written scores of articles on this blog regarding that very topic. Check out the archive for more on that.

    But men are also real problems today, which means men need to be criticized too. Harshly so. Again, that doesn’t mean I’m defending women or think that women are doing everything right. Obviously the opposite it the case. It means I’m calling men out for their pussy bullshit and their contributions to the very problems many of you guys are complaining about.

    Remember, I’m not here to take sides like you guys. I’m here to report things as objectivity as possible so that men can become better. I’m going to call women out for their crap, and men out for their crap. Both are guilty.

    2. If I talk about low-income men who live at home with their parents and play video games too much, and your first thought is “Well women suck today so why should I bother doing any more work than that?”, then you’re showing how completely and utterly warped your mind has become.

    You should want to make more money FOR YOU, not for some woman! You should want to build a business FOR YOU, not for some woman! You should want to live in your own place and be a free man FOR YOU, not for some woman!

    If all you can think about is how these things will affect possible women in your life, you have become entirely woman-centric in your thinking. You should want to make good money and live a free and independent life even if you never plan on have sex with a woman ever again. Read this article here. You need it.

    3. When you guys use manosphere-nerd phrases like “feminist grrl-power” or “value signal” and things like that, it shows that you’re a little too trapped in your alt-right / MGTOW manosphere bubble. In my opinion, you really need to back off on the time and emotion you spend reading manosphere sites (I barely read any, and I write for one!) and spend more time getting out in the real world increasing your income, achieving your goals and your Mission, getting laid, and improving your health and fitness.

    This anger and resentment isn’t going to make you a better man.

  59. I’ve just copied the above comment I just made into the actual post itself (at the end), since I see more of you woman-centric “give up” guys posting here.

  60. I would say its a number of factors here. The really old men who say voted for the system we have in place. A public school system that babysits until the age of 18 with socialist propaganda with little opportunity to get an outside job. How to fix that? After 8th grade, people should have the choice to work, take up a trade, or go to university. But the public is brainwashed into this system and yet complain about the results.

    Too many laws that make a 16 year old unemployable. I remember working at a retailer in high school. So the laws says I can unload trucks and stock shelves but I’m too dumb to use the cardboard compactor. I’m sure there are many other examples.

    We also have a monetary system that continues to depreciate in value. Since the public is ignorant, no real way around that. Unless you had some friends with some maturity on this, maybe you could do something on a $10/hour job and combine resources to make it happen in terms of a place to live and utilities.

  61. @sth_txs says
    > I would say its a number of factors here. The really old men who say voted for the system we have in place. A public school system that babysits until the age of 18 with socialist propaganda with little opportunity to get an outside job. How to fix that? …

    In regards to BD’s comment above — right on, and good move adding it to the article. Hopefully it’ll help a few men.

    As to the above, you know sure school sucks, sure regulation sucks, sure the dollar is a mess, but what you guys seem to be totally missing in all this suckage is that there is a HUGE positive force here.

    Look you are reading it right now. It used to be that schools jammed their propaganda down kids’ throats and they had limited alternative sources of information (the public library is the Internet of the early 20th century, and although an awesome thing, it is very much less useful than the Internet.) Today, there really is no excuse for continuing in that neonatal view of the world if you have access to a browser.

    Sure, women are probably a bit worse today than they were before, but you have the privilege of masses of information on how to deal with women, how to find the good ones, how to deal with their shit effectively etc.

    I’m in my 40s, and when I was in my twenties that sort of information was just simply not available, you had to learn the very hard and painful way.

    And more to the point, today, after the sexual revolution, women are far less weighed down by societal programming regarding their sexuality. Don’t get me wrong, they still have lots of nasty societal programming (as do men) but, to be blunt, women are far more willing to engage in sex quickly and frequently and with more men than ever before in history. And if you like kinky shit, they are FAR more likely to be open to experimentation than they were in the past.

    Sure “free” trade agreements, regulation, taxes, and other government crap make it harder and harder to earn an income at a job. But the Internet has liberalized the world. It is a thousand times easier to make it on your own today than it has ever been in history.

    Same regarding money and investing. When I was in my twenties you had to have a professional broker buy and trade stocks, and they charged something like $150 a trade, and controlled and manipulated you since they had exclusive access. Now you can trade everything from stocks, to metals, to options, to futures, to every possible ETF, to forex, to foreign real estate, easily with extremely low costs.

    Listen, it is so easy to sit around an complain about the many bad things in the country, but we live in a unique and amazing time when information about everything is EXTREMELY easy to find, and you have the ability to make your own way in a manner that has never before been known.

    The government certainly is chasing down to try to squash as much of that freedom as possible, but they are slow and sclerotic and you can be fast and nimble. Honestly, to listen to you guys talk it is like this is the worst time in the world to live. Exactly the opposite is true. This is easily the best time in the world to live to for the ordinary guy. So enjoy it! Revel in it! Make your fortune! Enjoy the long term happiness that is more readily available today than ever before!

  62. @Jack Outside the Box

    First, great name.

    Second, the meat of @Paul’s comment does a good job of summing up the points I was trying to make so I’m not going to get into a counterpoint-by-counterpoint back and forth.

    Like BD said in his update, women have their issues just like men do.  Unfortunately, the guys who would benefit most from BD’s advice are unlikely to find it unless someone introduces them to it, which if you’re a reader here, you should do.

    The crux of the issue is that we need to help and encourage these guys!!!  Most of them lack strong male role models and support systems.  The guys who are ready will listen but usually don’t know where to start.  Work with them to identify goals, develop action plans and don’t let them give up at the first sign of hardship.  I do this all the time with friends and acquaintances.

  63. Living with a woman takes more money than living without one. You know this from experience. So, why should a man, today, in the modern west, bother to earn more than he needs for himself? It’s a fair question.

  64. Living with a woman takes more money than living without one. You know this from experience.

    I am not recommending men move in with women. I’m recommending grown men not live with their fucking parents. I’m saying living with your fucking parents when you’re 32 is loser behavior. This has nothing whatsoever to do with whether or not to co-habit with a woman.

    So, why should a man, today, in the modern west, bother to earn more than he needs for himself? It’s a fair question.

    I’m not recommending a man make money for a woman in his life (unless he wants to). I’m recommending he makes as much money as possible FOR HIMSELF.

  65. I’m 18, almost 19. I have a manual labor Job, making about $450/wk. But, pay for my own food, own car insurance, own gas, own clothes.

    Yet, still live with my mom. In a couple weeks, moving halfway across the country to get away from here though.

    I can’t imagine doing what ‘manboys’ do until 34. I don’t understand it at all. There’s virtually no risk to health for aiming to be greater. But if manboys are simply apathetic about becoming better… I don’t understand. Especially if each day the world is getting better and better.

    Problem I’m having is allocation of my resources, but solution is to make more money. And I’m reading about sales and Web design, that should help.

  66. The defeatist attitude that I am seeing all over the replies is exactly what keeps so many people, men and women, trapped.  If you sit around thinking woe is me, I’ve been handed such a bad card in life, it’s so awful, there is nothing I can do about it, then it becomes a self fulfilling prophecy.

    My ex husband is one of these people that just refuses to try anything that he thinks he might not be qualified for.  So he’s stuck in a dead end manual labor job, despite having a master’s degree.  I used to find him all kinds of job openings that he would refuse to apply for because he thought he didn’t meet the qualifications in some way or another.

    It drove me nuts because I’m not a person that allows supposed limitations to stand in my way when I want something.  Women may be more, as a whole, likely to ignore someone telling them they can’t do something.  Men, on the other hand, tend to think in more black and white terms and are like oh, this isn’t what I’m trained for so I won’t even try.

    I’m not really sure what’s behind all the 20-something men that sit around playing video games and smoking pot all day, rather than getting jobs.  Maybe women are more motivated at younger ages because they usually shoulder the responsibility for taking care of children by mid 20’s and men these days don’t take that as seriously, because they know women will get it done.  There are sooo many single moms that are solely providing for children in their early 20’s while the dads do nothing to help.

    Me, I have multiple children and that was a legitimate reason, for a long time, to put the bulk of my effort into caring for them, rather than working outside the home.  Yet, because of that I have never had an opportunity to be lazy.

    It’s very difficult for me to relate to laziness.  I’ve never been someone that can just sit and do nothing or watch tv all day.  It would drive me crazy and it drives me crazy to see anyone else doing it!

    I have a younger brother, that is 26 and constantly flopping around from job to job.  He’s very into creating music and making videos and dj’ing and traveling around with his band, but that isn’t making him much in the way of money and unfortunately its a very competitive market to be in if someone is serious.  He’s had girlfriends that were turned off by his lack of direction in life, and its understandable to me, even though he has a hard time getting that point of view.

    Another one of my brothers, who is almost 35, FINALLY got himself together and got his master’s degree and went into the field of his choice a couple of years ago.  Then he got married and I’m sure will have children someday.  In his 20’s he was still partying too much, drinking too much, switching colleges, leaving for semesters and going back, and depending on family members to help him out with housing, getting a car, etc.

    I had it together, had graduated from college and had a good job before I was 22, even though I married young (before 21).  At 23 I had my first child so I spent many years being a stay at home mother and I don’t regret that at all.  Contrary to the belief of some, it IS a lot of work if you are putting effort into what you are doing with your children.  I was also actively involved in the church at the time, teaching Sunday school, attending board meetings, organizing fundraisers and helping with Christmas plays, etc., all with nursing babies and toddlers in tow.

    After my divorce it was much harder to stay afloat but I did do some work from home in order to squeeze by as well as leaned on government assistance in the form of food stamps and housing.  I had a legitimate excuse, childcare for several children is more expensive than it would have been worth for me to work outside the home.

    However, once my children were old enough to be at home for longer periods of time, I got my butt out there and busted it making money.  I was the top sales person for a year before being promoted to a manager position and am on my way to getting another promotion in another month or so.

    It’s really not that hard to make money.  What it takes is DRIVE.  What drives me is providing for my children.  As I tell other people I work with, its really not something special about me that makes me such a good salesperson.  Its that I put in the numbers and I don’t give up after rejections.  If someone says no I just smile and move to the next target with the same amount of enthusiasm.

    My current boss commented recently that in a week’s time I get more work done than the previous manager did in 3 months.  He calls me a workaholic and is like you need to take a day off sometimes, lol.  When I think about it though, that’s true of other successful people I know as well.  They aren’t satisfied with the status quo and just keep pushing and pushing and pushing themselves.  A lot of young men these days just do not have that kind of work ethic.

  67. I’m wondering if the childification of men hasn’t something to do with a general decline of male testosterone accross the world. Maybe both a result and a cause of the new political atmosphere, PC, etc, both reinforcing each other, or the modern lifestyle, or something else. The paradoxical thing is that it is testosterone, though directly linked to reproduction, that gives you the “I wanna better myself for ME, not just for chicks”. Wanting to do more than just survive, wanting to build big-ass monuments or tear things apart, etc, all this is strongly tied to T-levels (in women too). I’ve seen relatively reliable sources state that today’s average T-levels in men are perhaps as low as half those of WWI dudes. But again, it’s not clear whether this is mostly a cause or mostly a symptom. At any rate, I’d recommend all men mind their T-levels; it can be as simple as : get enough protein and sleep, suppplement with zinc and vitamin D, and prefer anaerobic (sprinting, weights…) exercise rather than aerobic. You might be surprised how this pulls you out of your apathy/complacency.

  68. Hey BD, a better follow up question (and possibly follow up post) might be a clear detailed list of what causes this and how men can avoid it, as society seems to encourage this behavior.

  69. I’m not really sure what’s behind all the 20-something men that sit around playing video games and smoking pot all day, rather than getting jobs.

    Life is too easy and safe. This means the amygdala does not develop. In effect, we are all brain damaged to some extent. Stuck in mental childhood due to lack of challenges.

    There are sooo many single moms that are solely providing for children in their early 20’s while the dads do nothing to help.

    Those women either chose the father of their children poorly, or are such complete bitches that it wasn’t worth it for them to stick around even for their children. Either way, not something to emulate. I’m not going to guess which was the case with you.

    But it is also another effect of the lack of normal brain development going on across the west. A weakly developed amygdala correlates with low parental investment. In effect, people think like rabbits. Fuck and move on. And when men become weak and unreliable, women become manly to protect their kids. You likely would not have worked nearly as much in the 50s. We are all products of our time.

  70. I think Weed plays a bigger part in this than you realise. It makes you damn lazy and all you really want to do is play video games, watch porn and stay in doors. Its the big stealer of drive and ambition. I did a lot of it in my 20’s but new it was doing nothing good for me.

    Since then I have done loads of shit like move abroad, and generally have my shit together. I am in my 40’s now and guess what, all my buddies from way back when are still smoking weed with a vengeance and porn seems to be playing an ever increasing role in their sad lives.

    Weed has become far too socially acceptable and has definitely contributed to what you are saying.

     

  71. I know this isn’t a weed debate, but whenever I smoked in the past all it did was super motivate me. Blaming laziness on weed is like saying cheese burgers are the reason people are fat… No, its lack of self control and discipline.

     

     

    As a 28 year old one thing I can tell you is the culture in America right now is not full ambition and motivation.

     

    “The economy sucks!” has been a song sung for a long time and peoples attitudes are contagious, it adds an air of discouragement towards actions in the vein of work/money.

     

    It seems like you really have to be a strong self starter and motivator, I think there are more opportunities for anyone than in any time in history however the path to success isn’t as straight forward as it was in my parents generation.

    EDIT: Also, if you’ve grown up on computers/phones/porn etc… You have stimulus overload all the time… You getting dopamine spikes all the time in a crazy way that kills motivation.

  72. I’m a bit surprised by the reactions to this. The average under-30 man behaves like a child—so what? More opportunities for me! The ways I improve myself, the ways fathers should teach their sons all don’t depend on the childishness of men around.

    By the way, BD, will you publish more on the subject of parenting?

  73. Hey BD, a better follow up question (and possibly follow up post) might be a clear detailed list of what causes this and how men can avoid it, as society seems to encourage this behavior.

    I think you’re getting a great list of the reasons right here in these comments.

    By the way, BD, will you publish more on the subject of parenting?

    Yes, but sporadically.

  74. Jack outside the Box
    Now you know why marriage was a better system for most men and even most women than what we have today. It may turn out that your vision of how the world should be may be better than the marriage vision, or it may not. Only time will tell, but I remain skeptical of your vision. I know it works for you and some other men very well and you don’t want to change it. I accept that it won’t be changed any time soon, probably not in my life-time, and I was born in 1968 so it is either adapt to the new normal of your ideas or suffer the consequences of getting horrible women, few women or no women. When men believe eve that they can’t get quality pussy or more pussy, most give up and go MGTOW to one degree or other. Others will succeed and get more pussy and better pussy but their numbers will be few. Some men will have both the aptitude and desire and one needs both and then the willingness to work at it, and at least some men will lack aptitude or lack desire or both, maybe most men. Expect the grass eaters and the violent men to grow in numbers. Micah Xavier Johnson, the Dallas Police murderer is an example of a loser with the ladies getting violent then getting killed as a result. You don’t have to like reality, but it is best to accept it and try to live accordingly like I am trying to do.

  75. @Atlanta Man

     

    Ukrainian here,also a doctor (obviously not in Ukraine).Laughed lots from how you are making plans into the future with the Russian woman. Your plane is going to crush,mate.

    And btw dating a Russian woman is nothing to be proud of.They are just one notch above Asians on the easiness (to date)  and beta tolerance scale.

  76. Being a manchild is bad but I’m not sure being a soulless money obsessive robot keeping spreadsheets of women is particularly healthy either.

  77. I must admit that this article is relevant to American,British men and culturally similar countries (Australia,New Zealand).

    In many European countries men mature by the age of 25-30.For example in the Netherlands by this age lot of people tend to own property and settle down.Similar in Scandinavia.

    At the same time Spanish and Italians are even more infantile than Americans,both men and women.Really depends on a society

     

  78. you really got the MGTOWs to come out of the woodwork on this one BD!

    LMAO the MGTOW butthurt is strong here. And people wonder why I troll and treat everything on the internet like a joke. Everyone’s egos are out of control lol. I can barely have a meaningful discussion on any platform without encountering massive butthurt.

    I mean, I guess I’m a manchild like what BD is describing but god dam, I’m not pissy about it. I just work at my shitty job, go on occasional dates and get occasional lays (with pretty much all types of chicks) and I do play my fair share of video games although I’m staying away from Pokemon Go and Call of Duty like the Plague. I’ll stick to old school stuff thank you very much lol. And marijuana just makes me drowsy so I stay away from it. I’m happy at the moment, and when I get bored I’ll find something else. Its all about discovering and rediscovering new stuff to enjoy.

    As much manchild shit that I do I still play sports and lift weights and whatever.

  79. Being a manchild is bad but I’m not sure being a soulless money obsessive robot keeping spreadsheets of women is particularly healthy either.

    Did you have any actual points to make, or did you just want to throw around inaccurate insults from the safety of your keyboard?

    For the rest of you MGTOWs, you guys are looking really bad in this thread. My opinion of you guys has definitely dropped several notches in the last few days reading these comments.

    I must admit that this article is relevant to American,British men and culturally similar countries (Australia,New Zealand).

    In many European countries men mature by the age of 25-30.For example in the Netherlands by this age lot of people tend to own property and settle down.Similar in Scandinavia.

    Yes, this is going to vary from society to society. True.

    LMAO the MGTOW butthurt is strong here.

    It sure is.

    Looks like I’ll have to make a post about our angry MGTOW friends…

  80. Another important issue is that “growing up” is more expensive than it was. Used to be you could buy an average home on two years income. No longer the case. Compared to 50-100 years ago, we had 4-16 times the purchasing power for the amount of time spent working.

    Taking on 30 years of debt just to have shelter for your brood is fine for some people. My parents did it. But it’s not for everyone, and getting less appealing by the year as the economy worsens and women do as well.

  81. The comments on this are surprising, I think it’s quite accurate and a lot of young men do need to pull their thumbs out of their arses. It’s disappointing seeing commenters that have spent way too much time on manosphere websites bringing out all these negative tropes

    No factory jobs-Factory jobs are fucking shit, everyone that’s been there for years hates it and likely has a number of injuries/musculoskeletal problems. Negative environments, not where a Alpha 2.0 wants to make a living. Plus substance abuse is likely rife

    No quality women-Chances are your attitude sucks, you’re a loser and that’s reflected in the women you attract. I love my life and I have a number of goals I want to achieve and interesting experiences under my belt, I meet plenty of great women

    Society/Women sucks, no point bettering yourself-I want to achieve my goals because they’re my fucking goals and I know by striving for them I’ll have an awesome life. If society/women don’t like them, they can kick rocks

    Men aren’t valued-The only time I thought this was when I read manosphere websites daily. Now, I value myself. My friends and family value me. That’s all I need

    I’m 23 and can’t be more excited to live each day. I just got back from Thailand and in the next few months I’ll be competing in BJJ and Boxing, hopefully joining the Police (job I’ve wanted for years) and enjoying being newly single after what was a largely great relationship that taught me heaps, but just wasn’t going to work. Got a list of places I want to travel to each year, and I know where I want to take my career as a Police officer.

    Life/College/Relationships/Travel/etc. are only as good as you make them. Everything in life is up to you. The sooner you ‘woe is me/the west sucks’ fellas realise that, the quicker you’ll pull your heads in

  82. @ Blackdragon

    I agree that every man should try to be a mature adult and work hard for himself if not to experience the joy of rewarding himself for a job well done, then at the very least out of dread for becoming a homeless beggar. This society we live in is taught at best not to value men by ignoring their plights and at worst is taught to abuse men. Women get taken care of more often than men and are more highly esteemed as well in our society. However, I am not surprised that men aren’t trying any more. Look, if a man can get laid just for being charming and constantly approaching women to sleep and have sex with and then he gets the women to provide him with food, clothing and shelter as well like a video of a man living in New York City you showed in article, then he has little incentive to do well in other areas of his life even if it is very pathetic life because the women provide him with enough in his own mind no matter how horrified you, I or someone  else may be to look at him. If another man keeps trying very hard to get women or make a decent living and keeps failing too much and too hard, then he too will have a desire to give up no matter how wrong that might be. For most people in order to succeed, their endeavors can neither be too easy nor too difficult whether this be genuinely true or their own delusional perception in their head. Like stand up comedian Dave Chappelle says, if it wasn’t for men getting sex from women then most if not all men would be happy to live in a cardboard box. Too many victories and too many defeats as well as too good of victories and too horrible of defeats is good for no one. I like Joelsufs attitude, but realistically if men don’t believe that working on themselves to improve themselves and their outcomes will lead to getting more or better sex from women and more and better women, then men have a strong tendency to give up and not try hard whether they are losers with the ladies or winners with the ladies. The Misuo of China are a fine example of this. For all that was wrong with the marriage based system before, at least it got a higher proportion of men to try hard to work on themselves and their lot in life unlike the system we have today. Something or Some things must be found in order to motivate men today.

    I should explain about the Misuo of China as I mentioned them above. It is a matriarchal and polymorous society unlike the ethnic Han Chinese society of today surrounding it which is more patriarchal and monogamous(at least pretends to be even if really isn’t)> The Misuo are  even more different from the Han Chinese in the past than today in these regards. The men have a reputation for not working very hard. At least their men have it better than our men because no matter how much the women folk may complain about their men folks laziness and how much they hate them, at least the women in their family work to support their men which means their women love their men more than our women love us in our society on average. The men also have no obligations financial or otherwise to their biological offspring unlike us American men which also makes Misuo men’s lives easier and arguably better. Misuo men have reputation for caring for their sisters’ children more than their own. I read that there are no words for jealousy and father in the Misuo language.

    I hope you read my comments and posts above from earlier days and times.

  83. May have come across as bragging too much. Point is I just don’t see most of these things red pillers complain about. I think this is the best time in history to be a young man and I’m very grateful

  84. @ Jack outside the Box

    I hope you read my comments above. The only thing I would add is that it seems most men are only motivated to improve themselves and to be more mature is if it gets them better sex, more sex, better women or to support children whom they consider their biological offspring because of (obsolete) biological wiring.

  85. @ Blackdragon

    The only thing I would like to add is that it seems most men are only motivated to improve themselves and to be more mature is if it gets them better sex, better, women or to support children whom they consider their own biological offspring because of (obsolete) biological wiring. Men also require hope which many do not seem to possess at the moment no matter how right or wrong that is. They need a better mindset. The Misuo seem to have a better matriarchal and polymorous system than the West does now even though because of social programing I would prefer a patriarchal and monogamous one, I could settle for something more similar to the Misuo one though, but I hate our current Western matriarchal and polymorous system and hope it dies to be replaced by the Misuo system or the old Western patriarchal and monogamous one.

  86. @Blackdragon

    Your equalist and polymorous system replacing the current Western Matriarchal and polymory system would be better too. The Misuo system allows the men to live like jigalos(men whores to women johnette customers) and some men would prefer that and some men would prefer your equalist and polymorous system while others would prefer the patriarchal and monogamous one while other men would prefer the patriarchal and polygamous one. Most men including me hate the current matriarchal and polymorous one though because of (obsolete) biological wiring and how demeaning it is to men and all of the other systems which I listed are better for men.

  87. @ Jack in the Box

    I left more comments above for you to read which I posted to you and Blackdragon. The only thing to add is I doubt humans are truly capable of an equalist system as it will either be matriarchal with women dominating or patriarchal with men dominating. If you mean that your system can be patriarchal with men dominating and polymorous, then I am skeptical of that happening too as it would de facto turn into a patriarchal and polygamous or very polygamous-like polymory system.

  88. @Blackdragon

    The only thing to add is that I doubt humans are truly capable of an equalist system as it will either be matriarchal with women dominating or patriarchal with men dominating. If you mean that your system can be patriarchal with men dominating and poloymorous, then I am skeptical of that happening too as it would de facto turn into a patriarchal  and polygamous or very polygamous-like polymory system.

  89. Note: The guy posting as “Jack” above is not me. I’m “Jack Outside the Box.” The other guy posting as “Jack” is a completely different dude in case anyone is confused.

    Also, I’d appreciate it if people stopped calling me “Jack in the box.”

    @Doclove: Yes, I read your comments and will be responding shortly.

  90. @Doclove:

    Look, if a man can get laid just for being charming and constantly approaching women to sleep and have sex with and then he gets the women to provide him with food, clothing and shelter as well like a video of a man living in New York City you showed in article, then he has little incentive to do well in other areas of his life even if it is very pathetic life because the women provide him with enough in his own mind no matter how horrified you, I or someone  else may be to look at him.

    For the record, I do not condone women financially providing for men. I think that is just as despicable and repugnant as men financially providing for women.

    No adult should ever provide for another adult (barring severe physical or mental disability).

    If another man keeps trying very hard to get women or make a decent living and keeps failing too much and too hard, then he too will have a desire to give up no matter how wrong that might be.

    A financially successful man is never a failure with women because of his financial success. If that were true, I’d never get laid. He’s a failure with women because he has no game, no charm, no masculinity, no alphaness, no attitude, and no attractive personality. Perhaps his drive for success hindered his skills with women because there are only so many hours in the day to learn new skills, but that’s no excuse. There are plenty of rich alphas out there.

    Similarly, there are two types of financial losers – the financial losers who do well with women and the financial losers who do not. The financial losers who do well with women do well for the same reason that the financial winners do well with women. Likewise, the financial losers/nerds/omegas who suck with women suck for the same reason that some rich men suck (hint: no game, no masculinity).

    You’ve admitted that many financial winners (beta nerds) suck with women, while many financial losers do well. But you neglected the other side of the story – many financial winners do well with women and many financial losers are frustrated virgins.

    What women are doing today is showing that they are NOT gold diggers. The common denominator in terms of sexual success with women (who aren’t hookers) is not money, but personality, alpha attitude, and game. THIS IS GOOD!

    For most people in order to succeed, their endeavors can neither be too easy nor too difficult whether this be genuinely true or their own delusional perception in their head. Like stand up comedian Dave Chappelle says, if it wasn’t for men getting sex from women then most if not all men would be happy to live in a cardboard box. Too many victories and too many defeats as well as too good of victories and too horrible of defeats is good for no one.

    So you’re saying that in order to motivate men, women MUST be gold diggers and prostitutes??? And they MUST raise the price of sex like a bunch of generous asexuals??? Oh hell no!

    realistically if men don’t believe that working on themselves to improve themselves and their outcomes will lead to getting more or better sex from women and more and better women, then men have a strong tendency to give up and not try hard whether they are losers with the ladies or winners with the ladies.

    And if men like you slut shame women (like you’re doing now) and encourage women to be prudish gold diggers who should “keep those legs closed and their standards high” in order to motivate beta males to succeed, then you are not only turning all women into prostitutes and taking all the genuine sincerity and female heterosexuality out of the sex (a conservative housewife is, after all, nothing more than a high class prostitute engaging in a cold business transaction), but you are also encouraging women to retard their own intellectual development and become the “dumb bimbos” that misogynists claim they are because you’re saying that men will give them everything without the women having to make anything for themselves in this world.

    The second a woman turns into a gold digger/prostitute (which you are encouraging in order to motivate men), is the second she ceases developing her own brain because horny men will give her everything for free. So she has no motivation for education, starting her own business, or contributing to this world in any meaningful way. The same thing you don’t like in men, you are causing in women. By motivating men in this manner, the women become the lazy losers (prostitutes) and rely on men to be smart for them!

    I don’t want men to be losers any more than you do. But you shouldn’t motivate men to be winners at the expense of women’s intellectual development by motivating women to expect financial slavery from men! Because then you’re turning our women into losers by teaching them to expect everything for free due to men’s hard work.

     

  91. Looks like I’ll have to make a post about our angry MGTOW friends…

    Can’t wait!! Trashing MGTOW is always fun. They claim that they are part of the “neomasculinity” movement when seriously, they don’t represent masculinity at all not one bit. Here’s what a MGTOW or alt-right or whatever acts like pretty much. I had the displeasure to work with an individual like this…its…quite accurate.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6bZnqyE14RY&index=3&list=PLJlcoMjhHTOc8VlrCE7DGRJzaCocNmb05

     

  92. @Doclove:

    The only thing I would like to add is that it seems most men are only motivated to improve themselves and to be more mature is if it gets them better sex, better, women

    So you’re saying that the only thing that motivates most men to succeed is women suspending their own heterosexuality and turning sex into a professional transaction in which women are the generous givers based on what a man has earned (the superior asexual ones) and men are the grateful receivers (the inferior heterosexual ones).

    So women are the judges and men merely audition? Dude, you’re more of a matriarch than you think. What tradcons call patriarchy is really a matriarchy.

    By contrast, an example of a true patriarchy would be women working their asses off to support us while we judge them on their success or lack thereof by generously giving them sex or withholding it based on how much money, success, and status women have earned. Now that would be a world degrading to women (which I don’t support), whereas the world you advocate and falsely call a patriarchy is a world very degrading to men (which I also don’t support).

     If you mean that your system can be patriarchal with men dominating and polymorous, then I am skeptical

    I hate patriarchy as much as I hate matriarchy. Within three out of the four life spheres (legal, political, professional) men and women should be equal, especially in the professional sphere since women working is the only thing which (1) lowers the price of sex and prevents sexual blackmail via parasitic financial extortion, (2) unleashes female heterosexuality which allows all sex between a man and a woman to be genuine instead of a forced business transaction between a female actress and a male fool so that the actress can eat and (3) turns female sexual behavior from generous to selfish, thus equalizing men and women in the bedroom and eliminating the “I’m not cheap” denomination of female supremacy.

    As for the fourth life sphere (the personal), our culture will be, more or less, patriarchal because that is what most women and men prefer. Male masculinity is, more or less, the source of female heterosexuality, so in the personal sphere, men will be the leaders because, otherwise women won’t be sexually attracted to them. There will, of course, be exceptions, such as submissive and feminine men being sexually attracted to dominant women and vice versa and that’s fine too.

    But yeah, in the legal, political, and professional sphere, men and women must be equal in order for sexual liberation and sex-positivism to be viable in the personal sphere!

    And for the record, I hate our current feminist matriarchy too because…well……it’s a matriarchy, which means it threatens to destroy female heterosexuality and male masculinity. But I hate the tradcon matriarchy (what you call patriarchy) as well, because that too is a female supremacist system in which women are the asexual judges and men are the heterosexual auditioners. Fuck that!

     

  93. I value myself. My friends and family value me. That’s all I need

    That’s all that anyone of any gender really needs. But you are forgetting that MGTOW need something else to value them (like chicks) because they can’t value themselves, and they have no friends and oftentimes no family to value them. So what they do is create hugboxes so they can circle jerk themselves online. No different from feminists really 😉

  94. No adult should ever provide for another adult (barring severe physical or mental disability).

    You may wish to have a talk with all of our male ancestors prior to agriculture and for most of the period following. Or apologize to women for calling them collectively retarded and handicapped.

  95. @Doclove: After thinking more about this…..

    The only thing I would like to add is that it seems most men are only motivated to improve themselves and to be more mature is if it gets them better sex, better, women

    …..I’m forced to conclude that you’re right. Everything I do to gain and maintain my success in life is motivated, at bottom, by my desire for sex and women but not in the way that betas and alpha 1.0s imagine.

    I shall explain:

    Money is necessary for proper logistics. At minimum, in order to lead the lifestyle I lead, I must have a house and a decent car. Without those two things, I’m fucked (and not in a good way).

    There is no way I could maintain my current sexual lifestyle if I were, for example, renting an apartment. Imagine having a threesome in a cheap one bedroom apartment with both women being screamers. The neighbors would bang on my wall and call the police, lol. And imagine bringing different girls home to the chagrin of nosy neighbors.

    My girlfriend recently had a threesome with two men on her living room floor (while I was at home finishing up paperwork before needing to go to sleep for an early professional meeting the next day). She has more money than me. Would she have been able to have that threesome if her floor were someone else’s ceiling? Not likely.

    Note: Several months ago, I tried having sex with a fuck buddy in her friend’s cheap apartment. Long story short – neighbors banged on wall threatening to call cops…………..neighbors called cops…….neighbors falsely accused me of rape to cops………cops busted in………..cops questioned fuck buddy separately………..fuck buddy told them that it was consensual sex………..cops apologized to us…..cops told us to keep it down……..neighbors never apologized……..ended up leaving and fucking her in my house a week later……my girlfriend laughed her ass off!

    Moral of the story for me: No more cheap apartment sex, lol!

    So for me, having game or being an alpha 2.0 in terms of my attitude/personality/masculinity is not enough. That may attract women, but it won’t take care of logistics. A decent car and a house (or at least a condo with triple thick walls) are the bare minimum requirements for leading my type of poly lifestyle.

    My advice to guys living in their parents’ basements and smoking weed all day is to seek the type of lifestyle that I lead. At best, these losers only have casual fuck buddies or one night stands at the girl’s place, or in a nightclub bathroom stall. Eventually, they’ll want more than that (and yes, that will include having kids). So in order to do that, you’ll need proper logistics. Proper logistics require money.

    So you can still be motivated by sex to better yourself financially, as long as giving money to the woman, or the woman caring about your money, is not the motivation. If that is the motivation, then you are encouraging women to be stuck up prudes and objectify men as walking ATM machines – something which is dehumanizing to men and detrimental to a woman’s sexuality.

     

  96. @Blackdragon

    If I talk about low-income men who live at home with their parents and play video games too much, and your first thought is “Well women suck today so why should I bother doing any more work than that?”, then you’re showing how completely and utterly warped your mind has become.
    You should want to make more money FOR YOU, not for some woman! You should want to build a businessFOR YOU, not for some woman! You should want to live in your own place and be a free manFOR YOU, not for some woman!
    If all you can think about is how these things will affect possible women in your life, you have become entirely woman-centric in your thinking.You should want to make good money and live a free and independent life even if you never plan on have sex with a woman ever again. Read this article here. You need it.

    In the several years I’ve spent reading manosphere-type sites I started to notice a pattern where a lot of these guys simply cannot change their thinking or worldview to accommodate the fact that marriage, long-term monogamy, and starting a family aren’t going to be realistic options for most men in today’s world. I think many of them spend so much time bitching on the internet about this stuff that they lose it to a certain degree and become one of the following:

    1. MGTOW types who seem really pissed off and absolutely cannot be bothered to do anything or improve themselves simply because life won’t end in some kind of Disney-like fairly tale version of monogamy. So for that one reason, they basically say “fuck everything, fuck women, fuck the world” etc.

     2. Conservative or religious types who spend time complaining about slutty women and a lack of morality. Many of these guys will start looking for their unicorn and honestly think they’re going to be able to make marriage or monogamy work in today’s world after wasting years “screening” girls for LTR qualities and complaining about all of them in the process.

    3. Guys who go hardcore into PUA/Sales mode and start doing shit like taking nootropics so they don’t have to sleep and obsessing for hours about the color of their pocket square. “Game your boss, bro.” “Game your female co-workers.” “Game everything!” A lot of these guys seem to not even care about sex that much and still have a monogamy-centric view where they’re looking for a girlfriend and hoping that after thousands of approaches and becoming a sales robot they’ll find a girl to settle down with.

    Obviously, none of these alternatives are probably a good long-term bet compared to just forgetting about marriage and monogamy and trying to build a successful, happy life from there. Most men just refuse to listen to the most rational, reasonable advice available right in front of them.

  97. Either way, Jack, you want money because you want sex. The precise distribution of your income is irrelevant to the overall point.

  98. Look, if a man can get laid just for being charming and constantly approaching women to sleep and have sex with and then he gets the women to provide him with food, clothing and shelter as well like a video of a man living in New York City you showed in article, then he has little incentive to do well in other areas of his life

    I agree that sex is a powerful motivator, but there are other incentives in life besides sex.

    Even if I never had sex, I’d still want to make a lot of money, drive a decent car, travel the world, lose weight and be reasonably healthy, love and take care of my children, read and gain knowledge, etc, etc.

    Moreover, a man boy is either A) not going to get laid at all, or B) get laid only from ugly / low-quality women. So even the man boy has incentive to better himself if he wants to get laid, or get laid with good looking women. (Yes, I know there are exceptions.)

    Also read Jack Outside the Box’s point about two kinds of financial losers; those who do well with women and those who do not, and how those who do are still getting it done.

    The only thing to add is that I doubt humans are truly capable of an equalist system as it will either be matriarchal with women dominating or patriarchal with men dominating.

    I agree and don’t care. That has nothing to do with the topic I’m discussing. (You’re mistaking me for Jack Outside the Box. He cares about society. I do not.)

    In the several years I’ve spent reading manosphere-type sites I started to notice a pattern where a lot of these guys simply cannot change their thinking or worldview to accommodate the fact that marriage, long-term monogamy, and starting a family aren’t going to be realistic options for most men in today’s world.

    Correct. I already described that problem in Part Five here, where I explain that most of the manosphere has essentially gone blue pill. Both MGTOWs and the right wing angry guys are all blue pillers who are upset they can’t have their blue pill anymore.

    The goal of life is to get what you want so you can be happy in spite of the fact we don’t live in a 1950s blue pill world anymore, not sit around and cry about how horrible everything is.

  99. BD, would it be unfair to say that you have kids because you didn’t know any better at the time? Because you were a monogamuggle before you turned into a polyamorous wizard? If you had started where you are today, would you have kids by now? Or ever?

  100. BD, would it be unfair to say that you have kids because you didn’t know any better at the time?Because you were a monogamuggle before you turned into a polyamorous wizard?

    Close. It would be fair to say I got married and monogamous because I didn’t know better. I still would have had kids, though I would have done it very differently.

    If you had started where you are today, would you have kids by now? Or ever?

    I’ve answered that before. Knowing what I now know, I would never have had kids at age 25 like I did. I would have waited until age 40 or 45 and then had one kid, but only with a woman who read my two chapters on raising kids in my book and agreed to that system. I would not have have children any other way, and go childless if my way wasn’t an option. Either way I would have waited until my 40s, when my big goals were done, before I had kids.

  101. To you guys asking about kids, I’ve got a post coming up soon about having babies (though not “kids”).

  102. @Jack:

    Unless I’m reading you wrong, you seem to equate getting their shit together with rising ASD, thus implying that becoming cougars and “riding a mini-cock carousel” is somehow childish and a real adult woman is a prude. I hope you didn’t mean it like this.

    Off course not!!! I’m dating one of those right now, they’re awesome! My take is there’s no point trying to predict in which “phase” a woman is.

    I don’t get this. How is being responsible, gainfully employed, financially independent, and with your own place a “game” that women play? It’s like some of you guys are trashing women for being gold diggers relying on betas (which I agree with you guys on), while also trashing them for being independent, making their own money, having a full time job, and enjoying life (which I disagree with you guys on).
    It’s as if she is damned if she does and damned if she doesn’t with some of you. What’s wrong with a woman making her own money like a responsible adult and enjoying her sexuality??? That’s precisely what we want!!!

    Man, I have absolutely no problem with that. Really. I like those women also, regardless of their shenanigans when you try to have sex with them. I dated one of them two months ago that I met via social circle and it was really nice.
    But If I want to get laid fast, I’ll completely skip cold-approaching those women (talking online here) and go for <27yos who will probably sleep with me on date one or two and give me very light resistance. Believe me, I field tested it time and time again on different sites/apps. I have very little time in my hands right now (my patience is kinda low also), so they are just not my bread and butter anymore.

    Can’t you have a relationship with them now? Why not?
    Let’s not become the male equivalent of gold diggers demanding that a woman make six figures before we fuck her, lol! Then again, that wouldn’t satisfy some of you either because then you’d just be trashing her for being independent and enjoying life. It’s weird to trash women for doing what us successful men do!

    See above. For the record, I love independent women.

  103. Complete feminist garbage! Women do NOT get paid less than men. That is against the law, as it violates the Civil Rights Act of 1964 which prohibits sex and gender discrimination in the workplace of any kind. The so called “gender wage gap” is a myth concocted by the lesbian, the fat, and the blue haired.

    Jack Outside the Box,  I just wanted to say that I’m not a feminist (not that I felt you were accusing me of being one).  (I like all of your comments too by the way.)  I honestly just believed that men were paid a higher salary for the same job than women and that it was just a normal fact of life; nothing that I was angry because of.  Not at McDonalds or anything like that, but I was thinking of more professional-type jobs, but I honestly just didn’t know.  I agree with you also that most women abuse vacation time. 

    I watched the video by the way.  I wish guys were valued more – they should be!  I really couldn’t believe the video, but I mean, I did believe it.  I value guys a ton; I see them as people to look up to and as people who would look out for my best interest and as leaders.  One more thing though, it seems like many guys these days don’t know how to fix a car or fix things inside of a house.  I wish more guys would get into that kind of stuff rather than playing video games……not that it affects me, because I’m not attracted to guys that play video games anyways – I go for the guys that work on cars instead.

  104. Those women either chose the father of their children poorly, or are such complete bitches that it wasn’t worth it for them to stick around even for their children. Either way, not something to emulate. I’m not going to guess which was the case with you.

    I wasn’t any of the above.  I wasn’t a single mom in my 20’s.  I was married for 13 years and a stay at home mom.

    In any case, we are talking about men and the blame is being turned back around onto women.  It doesn’t matter whether they are bitches or chose poorly, men should still be held responsible for their part in parenting their own children.  That’s another problem with men, and people these days. They don’t take responsibility for themselves, its always someone else’s fault.  Part of being a mature adult is saying okay maybe the other person was wrong but here was MY part and what I could have done differently.

    But it is also another effect of the lack of normal brain development going on across the west. A weakly developed amygdala correlates with low parental investment. In effect, people think like rabbits. Fuck and move on. And when men become weak and unreliable, women become manly to protect their kids. You likely would not have worked nearly as much in the 50s. We are all products of our time.

    How is it “manly” to protect your kids?  Lol  Protecting her offspring is probably the strongest drive any female in nature has.

    Why are we idolizing the 50’s?  Do you have any idea how much women worked PRIOR to that?  The pioneer women, the women who took care of children before the advent of public schools and dishwashers were doing a hell of a lot of work, not just taking care of children but on the farm as well, with children in tow.

    Women in the 50’s had a leisurely lifestyle, compared to most.  Kids in school all day, lots of socializing and husbands who worked hard to provide for the family. Fewer children than previous generations. Must have been nice….

    I’ve been a stay at home mom though, like I said, for 13 years.  It’s not all peaches and roses.  It’s a lot of work, especially when you have several small children and homeschool.  Keeping the house clean when you have kids in it all day is a monumental task.  In many ways, its harder than being a manager at a company.  I can now say that with the experience to back it, though I can credit raising kids for helping me learn how to manage adults.

    Work isn’t just done outside the home.  In any case many women these days do both, which is pretty impressive considering there are so many men out there who can’t even hold down one job, let alone do that and raise children.  That’s not to say there aren’t a lot of men out there doing admirable things, there are, but again they stand out against all the current laziness.

  105. Women are the gatekeepers of sex. They decide if it happens or not. If a woman is divorced, the responsibility ultimately falls on her. The man is responsible for leaving, but the woman is responsible for choosing a man who left her.

    Unless you think women don’t have agency, but in that case it would also mean they don’t get the privileges that come with it.

    And you jump right to blame, of course. Has nothing to do with it. Just cause and effect.

  106. In regards to the gender paygap, I thought you all might find this an interested article. It talks about “The Chart the Racial Grievance Industry Doesn’t Want you to see.”

    TL;DR — Asian men make an average of 117% what white men do, and Asian women make something like 105% of what white women do. Which is to say, how much you make really depends on what choices you make. If you think Asians don’t suffer racial discrimination, then you are not paying attention.

     

    http://thefederalist.com/2016/07/25/the-chart-the-racial-grievance-industry-wont-talk-about/

     

  107. I’m writing a book — very slowly — because I like the topic and I want to have the option to leave the West any time that I choose.

    Now if only I could get an extra 2-3 hours a day…

    Kids and work do consume that time…

  108. When I was 23, I was in an LTR with a unicorn and was simply too young and inexperienced to know it.  It lasted for 3-1/2 years and she wanted to lock me down.  I wanted to be footloose and fancy free and examine my options, and maybe – just maybe – that was a mistake on my part.  By the time I came around she had already moved on. I know BD’s view on monogamy and marriage 2.0 and such and I largely agree, but exceptions prove the rule, and this girl latched on to another guy and go married almost immediately. I stumbled on her Facebook account 20 years later and she is living in New England with her hubby and two daughters, who obviously get their looks from their mother considering she was mid-40s and looked exactly the same as when she was 20.

    Regret is a big, fucking waste of time so this is more of an observation and cautionary tale for younger guys: don’t look a gift unicorn in the mouth.

    And it is an interesting thought experiment of just how different my life would be if I had “manned up” at that age. I would have completed my business degree on got some middle management position and by now be making low six figures with a beautiful wife and 2.1 kids, 1 dog, two cats, a white picket fence and a minivan.

    But no, I went on to law school, fell for a BPD single mother, traveled to Australia, started my own game company, joined the army, became a divorce lawyer, ditched that and went into teaching, got ESL certification and came to China, and now at age 50 landed a good job that pays ok, lets me travel and I am in a Breakfast at Tiffany’s discussion with a much younger Chinese girl who does not want to be put in a cage while I want to actually settle down.

    I’ve read a lot of sociological data and saying that men finally grow up at 34 is not completely accurate but certainly in the ball park.  For me, as soon as my mom bitched at me to get a job I did so and moved out, much to her surprise and chagrin and that was in my early 20s. I boomeranged on her at age 30 when I decided to go to law school, my LTR gf gave me walking papers, and mom had decided to end her second marriage. We were roomies for about ten months.

    Depending on how you define it, I only grew the fuck up at age 30 or just recently as I approach 50. I like video games and I even have one published that brings me in sandwich money each month in royalties.  Maybe I have never grown up because I still design games, date women half my age, and jet set about. Maybe I have grown up because I want to pair bond and have vanishing desires to be a father. Maybe I have not grown up because I have no assets and just an ok income when – usually – I should be at my peak for both.

    I guess time will tell.

     

  109. Blackdragon’s vision of society would never scale. Women’s hypergamous tendencies would never allow for consistent sex for more than 50% of men. If you want a vision of BD’s utopia then look to most of human history. Genocide and slavery. Women would quickly be reduced back to chattel. Either that or we’d have an Orwellian police state 10x what we have now to effectively lobotomize and euthanize/eunichize men that went against the machine and tried to stir trouble.

    Also this absurd idea that we can have a society of entrepreneurs is beyond infuriating. One outlier with above average drive/learning capability/social skills (blog host). His business is based off of marketing, a value transferring (from hard producers) parasitic profession. It to will die once monetary sanity and discipline are restored. That and the current round of self help craze we are going through, dies a slow, painful death.

    For the record I enjoy BD’s work, but I’m not under the delusion it offers more than a 10% value bump to the usual PUA drivel.

    As for my own story… I was once a hard working beta. Have a good family, which encouraged hard work. I wanted a wife, a modest but cool house, a garage to work on my car in and tinker with electronics and maybe invent the next better mousetrap, teach the kids about fixing shit, a couple of kids, and maybe a dog.

    In high school I couldn’t even get a prom date. In college I was partially incel/partially afraid of kissing a girl and didn’t have cold approach to practice on, so the few social events I went to bore no fruit. Halfway through I gave up on wanting to contribute to society. I made a brief return to grace when I returns to NYC and was able to use cold approach to get laid a few times and even have a girlfriend. Will probably continue to put in some effort there. The bottom line though, is women don’t want most of us. The level of game you need just to fuck an occasional 6 makes the juice not worth the squeeze. Mitigating qualities like reliability, ability to provide for your family, (every man should be the hero of his household, if you believe in gender polarity – a cognitive dissonance blackdragon seems to ignore and simply dismisses as men wanting gold diggers) and honor are no longer valued/have much room to be shown. So what’s the point? I don’t play video games (I binge on occasion) but I’m generally lazy and depressed so I don’t have the attention span to tinker with things as I so enjoy. Every moment the nagging thought of, “what should I be doing to get laid???” comes and goes, but the big payday is never coming. Average work does not even yield average results in game. It’s a winner take all landscape with very few winners. Not every man can be the Jamie Dimon of game no sooner than can every man be the CEO of a major bank. Society would quickly collapse on itself from being top heavy. So it’s absurd to believe society could ever function under BD’s system.

    Fuck the parasite economy we currently exist in (read Karl Denningers work to know why we should minimize our labors). Fuck the monetary system which enables that parasite economy to continue misallocating capital to sanctimonious single moms, sharp tongued lotharios who try to undermine society’s stable structure all so they can get a little more ass (they to will most likely die by the sword which they helped forge), worthless degenerates who demand medical research on another’s dollar, but most of all fuck the traitorous men who know the truth but selfishly denigrate their brothers for taking the only road this overwhelming nihilism can produce. We can’t all be Solzhentizn and we can’t all have a priest carve the symbolism of Christ before our eyes, as we slowly bleed to death in this gulag of our own construction.

    No more. We will toil no more.

  110. Blackdragon’s vision of society would never scale. Women’s hypergamous tendencies would never allow for consistent sex for more than 50% of men.

    As I’ve repeated only about a thousand times, my recommendations are not for all of society; they’re just for 10% of men. I am not describing my vision for society here at this blog. I’m offering advice for you as an individual in a failed society that can’t be fixed. Please read part 2 here.

    I was once a hard working beta…I’m generally lazy and depressed

    Great. You went from hardworking beta to lazy and depressed beta.

    I went from hardworking beta to very happy Alpha. That’s the path I recommend. Not yours.

    No more. We will toil no more.

    As I keep repeating in these comments and what you depressed blue pill MGTOWs won’t listen to is: I’m not recommending you toil for women or society. I certainly don’t. I recommend you toil for yourself and your own happiness.

    Do you think I work 7 days a week for a woman? Or women? Or for society? If you do, you’re an utter moron and you haven’t correctly read a single word I’ve said on this blog or my books. I work hard for me and my happy life.

  111. Also, I get your blog posts are targeted at individuals, but this one was targeted at a civilization wide trend. Hence scalability criticisms are fair game..

  112. Also, I get your blog posts are targeted at individuals, but this one was targeted at a civilization wide trend. Hence scalability criticisms are fair game..

    No it wasn’t and no it isn’t. Even if the readership of this blog multiplied by 10x tomorrow, it would still not reach even 1% of the men in the Western world.

    I’m not talking to “society” and never will. (I couldn’t give a rat’s ass about society. Western society committed suicide a long time ago, so now I have no interest.) I’m talking to YOU and the tiny few men who read this blog.

    These scalability criticisms are a cowardly way of avoiding the topic of why YOU, PERSONALLY purposely choose a life of laziness, immaturity, depression, and unhappiness instead of happiness.

    You can try to take the focus off YOU all you like, but it won’t work here.

  113. Not sure how to quote people on this site, but I think the point is I’m happier just being lazy and not doing anything. Not having responsibilities and stress is satisfying and I think a lot of other men are to. That was JoelSuf or whoever the slacker up above was’ point.

    Don’t get me wrong, I have a job and make the break even for six figures, but things like living at home and not squeezing every last penny of labor out of myself keep me relaxed. Also living at home to save money is a good and honorable strategic choice.

    As for the toil no more comment, I think the point is I enjoyed providing and contributing to society or would have, but those things are no longer appreciated so I garner no enjoyment of doing things for myself. My brain is quite literally not built that way. I think the disconnect is you are wired more egoistic and value yourself over any other human being including your family because you believe in a purely deterministic atheistic universe and apply biological reductionism to its bitter end (i.e. If you die unhappy then your life was for not, no matter how many kids you raised well and parents you made proud). As for me I couldn’t live with myself to just completely abandon all those I love for my own pursuits. This is not meant to be judgemental or insulting by the way (I know you don’t care about others opinions of you, but just saying I’m not trying to disrespect you here or shriek about what a Bad Person! you are, like a shrieking femcunt..).

    FYI I’ve tried to change my outlook over the years, but it’s been tough. Seeing as how I recently re-entered the game after a few months of being in an LTR I might purchase some consulting services soon and so we may get the oppurtunity to chat face to face mwuhahaha.

    I think he guy above had it right as to why I and so many men are lazy now. Overstimulation has made concentration and sticking to one thing impossible. All I know is attempts to self motivate and improve career etc have fallen flat on their face thus far.

    Why did you call me blue pill though? I always considered myself red pill and angry… Been hanging out at Roosh’s blog since it was called DCBachelor.

  114. Not sure how to quote people on this site, but I think the point is I’m happier just being lazy and not doing anything.

    Incorrect. You just said you were depressed.

    Don’t get me wrong, I have a job and make the break even for six figures, but things like living at home and not squeezing every last penny of labor out of myself keep me relaxed.

    High income does not require “squeezing every last penny of labor out of yourself.” For most of my life I have made a six figure income on 30 hours a week of work or less. Refer to my book if you want to learn how to do that.

    As for the toil no more comment, I think the point is I enjoyed providing and contributing to society or would have, but those things are no longer appreciated so I garner no enjoyment of doing things for myself.

    Then you are insane. If you require society to approve of your lifestyle in order to be happy, you will never be happy, and in my untrained laymen’s opinion, you likely suffer from at least mild psychological issues if you can’t be happy without society’s approval even if you achieve personal success for yourself financially, sexually, and in your relationships.

    Notice that I’m very happy and don’t give a shit about society whatsoever. I don’t require society’s approval of my happy accomplishments in order to be happy. It’s sad and bizarre that you do.

    As for me I couldn’t live with myself to just completely abandon all those I love for my own pursuits.

    Again you misquote me, probably on purpose. And again, it won’t work. I don’t recommend this and never have. I have said many times on this blog that my loved ones are important to me and that I will take care of them (as much as is reasonable). It’s the rest of society I don’t give a shit about.

    FYI I’ve tried to change my outlook over the years

    It doesn’t look like it. You’re here defending your own unhappiness and loserhood.

    Why did you call me blue pill though?

    Because you said,

    Mitigating qualities like reliability, ability to provide for your family, (every man should be the hero of his household, if you believe in gender polarity – a cognitive dissonance blackdragon seems to ignore and simply dismisses as men wanting gold diggers) and honor are no longer valued/have much room to be shown.

    I always considered myself red pill and angry

    You’re angry? But…you just said you’re “happy” being lazy and doing nothing.

    Do you even see how insane you sound?

    (I hope the rest of you are paying close attention here.)

    Just say it: You’re a lazy guy and you prefer to be unhappy / depressed / angry than to put in the work necessary to be happy. Just say it. Be congruent to who you are instead of dancing around what you’re really trying to say.

    Been hanging out at Roosh’s blog since it was called DCBachelor.

    Not surprised at all and I rest my case. Roosh is blue pill, and has been for about 2 years now, as I’ve explained before.

  115.  

    No adult should ever provide for another adult (barring severe physical or mental disability).

    You may wish to have a talk with all of our male ancestors prior to agriculture and for most of the period following. Or apologize to women for calling them collectively retarded and handicapped.

    This is a deep flaw in many people’s thinking. Prior to agriculture, yes, things worked differently. But why base any decisions on those outdated concepts?

    Blackdragon’s vision of society would never scale. Women’s hypergamous tendencies would never allow for consistent sex for more than 50% of men.

    This is actually almost the same. Of course it’s true Earth can’t consist entirely of Blackdragons, and BD doesn’t wish for such a world. Also many Alpha-2.0-style businesses are detrimental to the society in the sense of pushing it farther from a perfect world, however you may define that term. For example, profiting from a smartphone game that wastes millions of man-hours worldwide. But the society doesn’t want to become a perfect world itself, it doesn’t want to be “saved”, so why not leave it to its own devices and care about oneself?

    As for a thought experiment where the society suddenly relapses and starts going in some sensible direction, no, everyone can’t work a location-independent Alpha 2.0 job. How are you going to build jet engines without huge machine shops? But if there are a lot of location-independent people around, location-dependent ones will demand and get much better terms and great degrees of personal freedom from their employers.

    It does take a change of mindset to stop caring about the society. But caring about something that doesn’t care about itself isn’t the best idea in the world, and becoming an individualist is the most sensible thing to do. Also I don’t think it’s true an individualist requires everyone else to be collectivistic, it’s not necessary to be a hypocrite with this worldview; I think a society composed entirely of individualists would work out great.

  116. caring about something that doesn’t care about itself isn’t the best idea in the world, and becoming an individualist is the most sensible thing to do

    Well said.

    The argument between me and these depressed MGTOWs is regarding what kind of individualist to be. The depressed, angry, resentful one, or the happy one with a decent amount of money and hot women.

  117. You made a number of valid points and admittedly it does look like there are a lot of contradictions in what I wrote and it would be a valid point to reexamine some things. I will need some time to consider them and post a response here.

    I apologize if I misquoted you on your loved ones and its not my intention to distort the truth, but it sounded like your mom was not thrilled about your lifestyle choices? I know it’s speculation but in my personal experience having expressed the desire to just bang tons of chicks with reckless abandon has caused my mom a ton of hurt (she wants me to live the Disney life and she feels like I erode my own generally good soul with an endless parade of limited fleeting pair bonds). I don’t know how it is for your mom but I’d imagine what she says to you and how she feels when she goes to sleep at night are two different things. Then again you are about 20 years older, already have a guaranteed genetic legacy, and at least have a functional career/business so there are many mitigating factors.

    I probably do suffer from some psychological ailments, seeing as how I can be happy one day and depressed the next, but as far as seeking society’s approval, I’d say I’m a dog that needs a pat on the head every now and then (classic Beta – hard to shake). Probably just by virtue of being brought up by a strong personality (family is intact but was raised by a female grandparent in the really young years because parents were busy with career goals). I live to serve, but at the same time came into conflict when I wanted to bang a lot of chicks over settling down or being more monogamous (it’s a battle between my primal urges and my need to please my masters who don’t want me doing such things and focusing on my career – they’d dissaprove even if my career was going well). It’s hard to do what you want when every single fucking person of success around tells you that you’re an immature idiot for wanting a lot of pussy (especially at the expense of career since I basically use my spare time to game in futility).

    I’m not really sure why I’m so lazy and unmotivated, but partly it’s because I don’t think I’ll find happiness in the pursuit of money or meaningless goals which society has defined as a good use of men’s time. I think I got you there… How is playing a video game and winning it different from building a business in real life and having it take off, i.e. Winning – all arbitrary goals. I can’t seem to convince myself that I could be happy pursuing such goals either. Believe me I’d love nothing more than to believe that working hard will bring me closer to what I want (“happiness” and really just lots and lots of ass – the two are one and the same for me, or rather lack of the latter necessarily impedes the former – necessary but insufficient condition), but I don’t see a clear path to victory or really even know how to come up with a road map. An extra $50-$100k isn’t going to make my life much better nor my game…

    In any case I just bang my head against the wall going out and trying to pick up chicks while also spamming the online dating apps. I have yet to find a method for either of these approaches that isn’t demoralizing given its difficulty.

    Finally, yes, being angry has a certain satisfaction in it (some of the time). It allows me to excuse some of my own failures on occasion or inadequacies relative to others (not as smart, not as good looking, not as charming, not as creative, not as successful, etc).

    I guess I am a loser by the standards in the post. Not sure why you think guys should strive to accomplish something if it’s not for reproductive ends though. We are all dirt in the ground at the end and I think most people don’t get enough positive juice from the end result to justify he hard work that’d go into doing it…

    When I said Roosh I meant the roissysphere.

    Then again I think I could be happy if I had a clear guarentee path to success. The extreme uncertainty of everything we do in this life is something that drives me literally insane. Especially the female front even when done on a large number probabilistic scale:

    I think I finally get your red pill/blue pill distinction. For you it’s not the manosphere/roissysphere awareness that hate facts exist and that the female psyche is different from what we know. You are literally using the original matrix definition of the terms. To take the red pill is to remove the shackles of slavery. Accepting woman’s true human nature is just one very small element of it in the redpill worldview. To the extent that I buy into an older society narrative, yes, I am blue pill at this current moment in time.

    I hope I didn’t misinterpret anything this time, but if I did I apologize, I’ve only been studying this blog on and off for about a year and the archives are quite numerous/some of your concepts are different from the rest of the manosphere blogs. It is far less reactionary than most of the alt-right as well.

  118. To the anon commentator above. I guess the fear of contributing to society’s devolution is eventual payback. We are on the verge of a reactionary right wing revolution. Those people will not look kindly upon us and may decide to kill us using the apparatus of the state or at least find ways to make our lives miserable. I guess in that sense alpha location independent 2.0 will be alright, but personally I have no desire to ever leave the U.S. It’s rather beta to have another man take your home from you as well if I might add… Also there is no guarentee you will hop that plane before the stormtroopers come, soviet style. Plus, can a location independent alpha save his family in this scenario? The one who stays and fights at least can protect family to some extent. This scenario is way more likely than people give it credit for given recent rumblings.

  119. I apologize if I misquoted you on your loved ones and its not my intention to distort the truth, but it sounded like your mom was not thrilled about your lifestyle choices?

    Correct. But A) she still loves me and we have a great relationship and B) I’m NOT going to live my life based on what my mom thinks about it. Are you fucking kidding?

    That’s the difference between a man and a boy. You’re worried about what your mom thinks of your life. I am not.

    I’m a dog that needs a pat on the head every now and then (classic Beta – hard to shake)

    Then yes, you are a beta. At least you’re admitting it. Now you have a choice. Remain a beta and justify all of your pain, or become Alpha.

    It’s hard to do what you want when every single fucking person of success around tells you that you’re an immature idiot for wanting a lot of pussy

    Again, you care about what society around you tells you. Do you think I care if people call me immature? Do you think it bothers me in any negative way whatsoever?

    How is playing a video game and winning it different from building a business in real life and having it take off

    Because building a business generates money with which you can improve your lifestyle and experience wonderful things you couldn’t without the money (like travelling the world, as just one example). Playing video games does not do this.

    It’s stunning that I have to explain things to you that the typical 6 year-old already understands.

    An extra $50-$100k isn’t going to make my life much better

    Wrong. And deep down, you know it.

    Man, you really are depressed.

    I guess I am a loser by the standards in the post.

    It sounds like you’re a loser by normal societal standards as well. That is not a personal attack by the way; it’s an observation based on the wording you just used to describe yourself.

    Not sure why you think guys should strive to accomplish something if it’s not for reproductive ends though

    Then why do you strive to play video games? That’s not for reproductive ends.

    Again, you justify your loserhood and pain instead of getting off your ass to improve it.

    When I said Roosh I meant the roissysphere.

    Roissy/Heartiste and his followers are also blue pill.

    To the extent that I buy into an older society narrative, yes, I am blue pill at this current moment in time.

    I know. Does that make you happy?

    Nope.

    I’m done responding to you because you’re at the point where you’re repeating yourself. I wish you the best and I hope you break out of your depressed, “Everything sucks so why bother?” state. Good luck.

  120. this whole blogg post is one big movie theater of projection. I’m glad I brought pop-corn

  121. You know I thought I’d share something I think about — in fact I have section in my personal database dedicated to this, and that is the question of “How does money make life better”. The truth is that money can make your life worse if you apply it wrongly, but money, when used correctly can absolutely make your life better.

    First of all, buying fancy toys or huge houses, or cars is, generally speaking a TERRIBLE way to spend money. They say that when you buy a new car it goes through several stages:

    Month 1. I LOVE my new car — man this thing is better than sex.

    Month 2. I really enjoy my new car.

    Month 3. It is my car

    Month 4: I wish it wouldn’t make that annoying noise.

    Month 5: Stupid car, it needs servicing already?

    Month 6: I wonder when I can get a new car to replace this heap of junk.

    Having said that, things don’t bring happiness but money can absolutely buy happiness, or at least increase your happiness. How?

    1. Money can buy you time. Time is your most precious resource. It can buy you time lots of ways from taking a cab instead of a bus, to hiring a maid to do your shit for you, to buying turbo tax to make your taxes easier, all the way to having enough to retire and do the things you really want to do without worrying about swapping time for money.

    2. Money can buy you experiences. Although “things” rust and depreciate, and you value them less and less, experiences are almost the opposite. That amazing trip to Brazil I took ten years ago still resonates with me. Or perhaps it isn’t as fancy as that, perhaps it is a lovely meal with someone you care about, or the opportunity to go sky diving, or renting a boat to go fishing with your friends. Money buys that stuff.

    4. Money buys you health. The American medical system is utterly fucked up, and it is getting worse. However, the plain fact is that money can definitely go a long way to fix that. Concierge doctors services for example, or medical tourism, or the ability to buy drugs you might not otherwise have, or other forms of direct access where you skip the insurance company. Sure you still need medical insurance for emergencies, but paying for medical care directly can totally transform the experience.

    5. Money makes many small problems go away. There are lots of small, annoying problems in life that you can simply make go away with money. For example, Recently some kid clipped off the door mirror of my car and then disappeared. I can get all upset of try to track the guy down, or I can just not sweat it and get it fixed and move on with life. I can do my company books and spend too much time trying to understand what all this IRS nonsense means, or I can pay someone a few hundred bucks a year and make it all go away. I can deal with the fact that my computer is running ridiculously slow, or I can buy a better faster computer.

    6. Money provides security. If you have a nest egg then you do not need to worry about things like what to do if you are off work sick for an extended period of time, or your house needs a new roof, etc. Money can eliminate that problem and simply make it go away with all the stress causing consequences.

    7. Money give you access. There are lots of things that you simply can’t get access too without bucks in the bank. Do you travel a lot? Airport premium lounges make travelling better. Do you want to talk to such and such a person? A charity auction ticket makes it possible.

    8. Perhaps one of the greatest things money can do — if you have it you can give it away. There are few things in life more enjoyable than helping out a cause that you think is really worthwhile — whatever your cause might be.

    So money is a huge benefit if it is used right. I don’t believe that $70k figure BD has mentioned before. Perhaps above that the marginal benefit decreases, but if I made $70k I would not be able to do some of the things listed above and would certainly be less happy.

    I don’t understand why someone would choose to burn away their precious time on some stupid video game when they could be walking the beaches of Corfu with a beautiful gal, or partying with the friends in a Vegas Casino, or diving with sharks on a Pacific island, or watching a football match with their kid — before the kid is too old to wan to do it with him. Life is so much richer than that empty pixels on a screen. And money buy you access to life. Buy YMMV.

    Again, money can ruin your life if you are a idiot about it, but it can also be a huge source of happiness.

     

  122. @Doclove: My response to your first post:

    That leads me to my next point. A higher percentage of jerk boys/ men and immature boys and men get women to ejaculate their penises especially when they are teenage girls and young women. Why would boys or men change if that is what you women are rewarding?

    Women are NOT rewarding it. These women are just showing that they are not gold diggers or prostitutes!

    Keep in mind: There are plenty of rich and successful men that these women are sleeping with, just like there are plenty of poor, broke, and unattractive losers that these women are viciously rejecting! You’re mixing correlation with causation.

    The common denominator here is not money, or a lack of it! It’s masculinity! If you are a charming and attractive man, women will bang you, whether you are rich or a poor jerk! If you are a skinny poindexter with an underdeveloped body, women will reject you even if you’re a millionaire, and yes, also if you live in your mommy’s basement playing video games!

    Why would men change to become responsible when you ladies don’t reward it when the boys and men are younger and quite often punish or ignore it?

    No one is punishing or ignoring male success. Women are simply abandoning the role of the hooker and are now demanding that a man be sexually attractive (whether rich or poor). This makes the sex genuine and sincere, instead of women fucking unattractive poindexters for their money.

    In other words, women are no longer selling out! THIS IS GOOD!

    This leads to a pattern of immature and jerk behavior which is difficult to break and won’t be broken if broken at all until these men are older.

    You’re confusing two subjects: Being an immature man child who is still living in his parent’s basement while working the night shift as a janitor at age 33 (which is what BD is trying to talk about) vs. being a very sexually attractive and charming man who also just happens to be very financially poor and going nowhere professionally!

    BD is trying to tell the man children to stop being such losers but you insist on talking about the latter subject saying, “But how can men stop being losers when women no longer sell out their integrity to the highest bidder by fucking sexually disgusting betas for money???”

    That’s literally your entire argument! Don’t you see that if men’s success is predicated upon women being prostitutes, actresses in bed, and sell outs with no integrity, then those men don’t deserve success?

    Women today (who aren’t gold diggers) are showing remarkable strength of character and moral principle by refusing to sleep with unattractive computer nerds, even if those nerds have money!

    Would you have regular sex with an obese woman with no teeth just because she’s a successful entrepreneur making seven figures???

    Until recently, that’s the equivalent of what women used to do (and gold diggers still do). How can I be anything other than a misogynist in the world that you want to go back to – the world in which women had no integrity and were just sell outs???

    Thank god women today are more sincere and want to be genuine heterosexuals! Stop trying to shame them for their integrity and telling them that they should be money grubbing whores with no values instead (i.e. housewives)!

    Why mature to become a husband and father when you don’t have to do so?

    You should mature to become a father if you want kids. You should never be a husband.

    Choices should be made from a position of strength, not because you have to. You seem to want to go back to a time when choices were forced on people as a matter of necessity, thus preventing people’s true personalities from shining! Now that we live in a world where men and women’s true personalities can shine, as people make choices from a position of strength and happiness, you are horrified!

    I’m sorry, but when I was a beta, if I even suspected that the woman was faking an orgasm, I’d leave. I’d rather get no sex than fake sex! If I believe a woman is with me, not because she wants to, but out of some perceived necessity on her part, I leave.

    You want to go back to a sad world where the human personality is suppressed under a mountain of necessities  and painful realities, in which no choices were real, but all were forced by circumstances, thus preventing us from really getting to know anyone or initiate a spiritual connection with! You want to go back to the third world! No thanks!

    In fact getting married and becoming a father is at best ignored and at worst punished.

    Because getting married is beta. As for being a father, I don’t condone taking away the human rights of fathers in family court (which is what’s happening) and robbing them or child custody. But I do condone women making choices from a position of strength, which includes leaving unattractive men with money or no money and having hot sex with attractive men with money or money.

    The thing that seems to bother you is that a poor hot guy is preferable for women than a rich ugly guy! Um…..yeah, that’s called integrity and strength of character AND YOU ARE TRASHING IT!

    Actually the over all sexual market place of which the marriage market place is a subsidiary at best ignores such immature jerk and immature behavior among teenage and 20 something men and quite often worse it rewards and fails to punish it.

    See above! If women were to punish men who have no money with a lack of sex, despite those men being attractive to those women, women would lose their integrity and the very core of their true personalities in favor of being prostitutes who sell out!

    You get what you pay for or what you reward and punish.

    The only way your point would be valid would be if women would punish all rich men by refusing to fuck them and insist on all sex-worthy men being poor! But that’s not what’s happening! Plenty of rich masculine men get laid, just like plenty of financially broke men get laid if they are masculine. But the rich AND POOR poindexters are being left in the dust!

    We’re moving from “woman as sell out/whore” to “woman as genuine human being with real personality” AND YOU ARE TRASHING IT!

    Nice and responsible men don’t get rewarded when they are in their teenage and 20 something years and are at best ignored and at worst punished.

    They’re not rewarded for being nice and responsible because these are gender neutral qualities, not sexual qualities. But they are not punished for these qualities (again, masculine rich men get laid). Instead, they are being punished for being beta poindexters!

    Men either respond by becoming a charming jerkboy women love to have sex with and ejaculate as Heartiste would say or they give up in disgust and go MGTOW.

    Why not become a charming jerk boy AND make money for yourself so you can have the necessary logistics and privacy to lead a wild sexual lifestyle with multiple women (which the jerk living in mommy’s basement can’t have)?

    Heterosexual teenage boys, young men as well as middle aged and older men are only responding to incentive and disincentives you ladies give them. It’s the world you wanted, and now you have it, ladies and gentlemen.

    Yes, the incentive is to be sexually attractive, masculine, charming, charismatic, confident, competent, outcome independent, and dominant. Those are the qualities women find attractive! If you have these qualities, you’ll get laid, whether you’re rich or poor. If you don’t, you won’t, again, whether you’re rich or poor!

    When women choose the poor alpha over the rich beta, that’s not an indictment of the beta’s success or responsibility (gender neutral qualities). It’s an indictment of his lack of gender based qualities that make women wet when women are in touch with their real personalities, unhindered and unsuppressed by personality suppressing circumstances or third world garbage conditions!

    I want humanity to be real and genuine so that we can have spiritual connections with each other BASED ON OUR TRUE SELVES! You want humanity to be fake and survival based, no different than animals whose every source of beauty is coincidental!

    For the above reason, we will never agree!

  123. @Mazurka:

    1.  Marriage and family is a scam today

    Marriage is a scam today. But family is not. Unless you’re talking about the traditional monogamous family. Then yes, that’s a scam as well.

    But families come in all shapes and sizes. Stability, love, and affection for the children from both a mother and a father are the things to promote. The poly community and people in open relationships have all the above necessary things to raise happy and healthy children!

    and thus there is no motivation to work hard to value signal to women.

    You should never work hard to value signal to women in any case. Because you should want to discourage female mercenaries and gold diggers. But, there are plenty of motivations to work hard. Let me list some of them:

    1. Ensure proper logistics and privacy for sex (house, car).

    2. Support your future children which you will have within the context of a red pill open/poly relationship with a loving and very high sex drive female who will have other men on the side while you have other women on the side. You may even have threesomes and group sex with her. This lifestyle is tied to #1.

    3. Support yourself in your old age as well as in your young years in order to live a comfortable life and buy time, as Fraser said, so you can travel the world, go rock climbing, and fulfill all your desires.

    4. Support and protect your right to free speech! If free speech is important to you without the need for anonymity, you REALLY don’t want to be someone else’s employee!  You want that “fuck you” money so that you can say anything you want on youtube, Facebook, or wherever while showing your true face! I’m not even there yet!

    2. Women spread their legs for PUAs and guys that run game not beta providers.

    But you shouldn’t want to be a beta provider anyway! Who said anything about providing for women, or any other adult who isn’t you?

    And I, as a man, also spread my legs for women who run game on me all the time! Being seduced by a woman is so much fun!

    Are you saying I shouldn’t spread my legs for a woman who wants to sleep with me unless she has a PhD in Chemistry from the University of Who Cares, despite how hot she is and how much fun her and I can have, because I am otherwise contributing to her laziness?

    Dude, her laziness is not my problem. She will pay the consequences of it in one way or another. I’m not going to turn myself into a male prostitute and give myself away only to the highest bidder while withholding myself from everyone else at the cost of my sexual satisfaction and happiness just to motivate the lazy bums to stop being lazy! LOL!

    I would ask those women who complain about child-men, ” If that isn’t the kind of man you want then why do you sleep with them?”

    See above. Many women don’t want to trade sex for money. They want to trade sex for sex. For this reason, they will sleep with poor men as well as rich men, without regard to prostitute type concerns.

    If a female FB of mine is on welfare, I’m not going to keep my legs crossed until she makes money! That would be ridiculous. I’m not a male escort, sir! I actually respect myself!

    If I find her to be generally irresponsible and not to my liking than I may never upgrade her to FWB (to say nothing about MLTR or OLTR), but there is no reason we can’t have fun in bed! Why would I deny myself and her pleasure, just because she’s a loser in a subject that I care nothing about?

    The women who are complaining about “men lacking money, ambition, status, etc…” are either gold diggers, conservative Disney prudes who precisely don’t sleep with poor men, and women who do the whole “alpha fucks, beta bucks” split and hate that more and more betas are refusing to fund her sexual lifestyle due to the betas catching on that they are being screwed over as a result of these women’s lack of discretion with alphas. So betas are now dropping their tools and demanding free sex as well. Many women don’t like that because they want free money.

    I, on the other hand, am glad this is happening, because women should be forced to earn their own money if they want to be comfortable (which is good for women’s spiritual development as well), while the betas should improve their game and become alphas if they want sex (which is good for these men’s spiritual development as well)!

    It really is win/win. But the losers are whining that it’s too hard, so the male losers are going MGTOW and the female losers are becoming prudish and either slut shaming women for “giving” it away for free (which you are encouraging, but shouldn’t) or becoming feminists and trying to shame men for “being little boys” and “selfish objectifiers of women and rape apologists” just for wanting consensual sex – a feminist strategy that is even less likely to succeed in the long term than the tradcon slut shaming one!

    By contrast, I’m happy that these losers (both male and female) are miserable because, from my point of view, it means good things are happening. And if these harsh circumstances force some of the losers to become winners by getting a job (male and female) and upping their game (male), all the better!

    Cheers!

  124. @BlindIo:

    You may wish to have a talk with all of our male ancestors prior to agriculture and for most of the period following. Or apologize to women for calling them collectively retarded and handicapped.

    Seriously dude? I didn’t think I’d have to state this but:

    Everything I say applies only to the present time and only to western civilization. I understand that before the industrial revolution, work was physically deadly and tough. So women weren’t physically capable of it. As such, females stayed at home and did the housework, while the males engaged in hard labor, got paid, and supported women with that money. At the time, that was the only way. So women couldn’t afford to be true heterosexuals because they had to marry a man who would provide them with their survival needs, while their sexual needs were, of necessity, irrelevant and only coincidentally satisfied!

    That would have been hell for men like me because satisfying a woman in bed and being confident that she picked me because she chose to and not because she had to is precisely the one thing which gives me all of my pleasure in these situations.

    Well, thanks to technology, industry, modern day medicine, computerization, indoor plumbing, air conditioned offices, safe mental work, cars, the Internet, etc… those days are gone. So today, providing for another adult, whether male or female, is stupid.

    It was necessary in the past, but this isn’t the past. It’s still necessary in modern third world shitholes, but I’m not addressing people from places like that. Duh!

    Either way, Jack, you want money because you want sex. The precise distribution of your income is irrelevant to the overall point.

    No it’s not! The point that Doclove was making was that men aren’t motivated because women are no longer sexually interested in providers. So women are no longer prostitutes who give men fake sex with fake orgasms just so they (the women) can have a roof over their heads.

    I say that that’s good, because women shouldn’t want providers (they should get off their lazy asses and provide for themselves) and men shouldn’t want to be providers (it’s a degrading and slave-like existence).

    But men can’t get over that ego boosting role of the chivalrous white knight attending to the damsel’s every need while she rewards him with sex and never shares her body with anyone other than him, just out of loyalty and gratitude. It’s a bullshit fantasy that’s more disrespectful to men than women, and men are going MGTOW and giving up on society because they can’t get over the death of this fantasy! It’s pathetic.

    But they should be motivated to make money for the same reason I am. What kind of sex life can you have if you’re still living with mom at age 35? What kind of sex life can you have if you have no car? These MGTOWs aren’t happy. They’re disappointed Disney men who want submissive virgin angels who will be monogamous with them for life or nothing!

    Then they’ll get nothing because red pill truths are just too painful for them, whereas I believe that those same truths are beautiful. I mean, who wants to be a woman’s only source of sex anyway? I sure as fuck don’t want that responsibility. She’d get so needy and insecure that I might leave her, we’d fight a lot, and she’d insist on my monogamy so other girls don’t take me away and we’d fight some more….

    If the blue pill lifestyle worked and were true, I’d kill myself. It would be hell for me. But these MGTOWs want women to worship them, be dependent on them financially, be virgins for them, never cheat, be loyal little housewives….And if the man’s ego can’t be satisfied like that, he’ll just go MGTOW, drop out of society, call all of them “sluts” and “whores” who always cheat (as if that’s bad), and just retreat to their video games. Again, pathetic!

    P.S. Just what the fuck is “Pokémon Go?” Or “Pokemon” for that matter?

     

     

  125. Regardless of changing times, women are still attracted to violent men and men still prefer women who display healthy genes. The fact that the white birth rate is below replacement level very likely has something to do with people trying to ignore biological reality.

    And this has been bugging me for a while so I’ll just say it. You talk like a woman. Way too wordy.

  126. @BlindIo:

    Regardless of changing times, women are still attracted to violent men

    These are mostly conservative and gold digging women who want to use men’s violence to their advantage by essentially turning these men into these women’s personal pit bulls. Gold diggers, 1950s Disney whores, and psychotic women sending marriage proposals to death row inmates fall into this category. Men’s violence is a tool in the hands of these old fashioned and primitive women!

    These are also the women who enjoy kinky sex or rape role playing as a way of testing the man’s violence (i.e. his potential as her slave) in a controlled environment!

    But I think the more sexually open minded a woman is (i.e. the less she wants to enslave a man for her own materialistic desires), the less turned on she is by physical violence. Rather, sexually liberated women enjoy psychological and emotional drama, but not physical bloodshed.

    and men still prefer women who display healthy genes.

    I cannot argue here. As a normal man myself, the only women I want to have sex with are those with healthy genes, healthy bodies, and decent visual displays of fertility.

    The fact that the white birth rate is below replacement level very likely has something to do with people trying to ignore biological reality.

    I think the declining white population has more to do with socialism and governments replacing children in the “taking care of the elderly” department. Capitalism, by contrast, incentivizes fertility.

    So I’m assuming by “biological reality” you mean that slut shaming and traditional 1950s conservatism are good and natural?

    And this has been bugging me for a while so I’ll just say it. You talk like a woman. Way too wordy.

    Occupational hazard. As an attorney, I try to be as thorough as possible in order to minimize room for misunderstanding. But you’re right. I think I’m tied with Kryptokate at this point in the lack of brevity department. But Gil Galad is even worse (and he’s also a dude, so I doubt it is strictly correlated with gender).

    Roissy/Heartiste and his followers are also blue pill.

    what

    Yes! They are all a bunch of prudish/puritanical tradcons with slut shaming Disney fetishes! That’s blue pill!

    I fail to see the difference between Heartiste’s perfect utopia and Afghanistan or the Massachusetts Bay colony of 1610! He’s a closeted Bible thumper and an enemy of sex-positivism and sexual freedom (a view that I do believe you share with him).

     

  127. @CocksuckingMotherfucker:

    Been hanging out at Roosh’s blog since it was called DCBachelor.

    Well there’s your problem. A slut shaming Disney virgin worshipper is not worth your time. Hypocritical men wanting sex, but hating women who want sex, is my worst pet peeve with the manosphere!

    When I said Roosh I meant the roissysphere.

    Ha ha! Another 1950s slut shaming tradcon who needs a one way plane ticket to Saudi Arabia!

    Come to the red pill (i.e. sex-positive) side! Learn to love women who love sex!

  128. @Fraser Orr:

    Russian women are quite lovely in my experience, they have that Slavic genetics and a culture that very much inculcates femininity into them.

    You’ve got to be kidding! If I’m wrong in Atlanta Man’s case in the sense that his specific Russian girlfriend is not how I thought she is, then so be it. I’m glad. But come on man! You know as well as I do that Russia is Gold Digger Headquarters! They’re ruthless female mercenaries who learn at age 12 to suppress their heterosexual instincts in order to secure the best male slave/provider and then “give” him sex from a position of asexual generosity in return for his resources!

    In fact, the Hollywood movie “Pretty Woman” is the typical Russian woman’s idea of Disney! They see themselves as prostitutes hoping that a billionaire beta will take them away from all work!

    Although there are exceptions (like Atlanta Man’s girlfriend apparently), Russian culture produces despicable women who hunt men for money with sociopathic zeal and a complete disregard for their own sexuality or sexual pleasure (framing it instead as a gift to the best male slave).

    I’ve met many Russian women, and dated one, and she was simply spectacular in every way.

    Good for you! A small minority of them actually have super high sex drives and firm beliefs in a gender neutral economy. But those are the exceptions. The “femininity” that you talk about is mostly just disguised gold digging!

    BD, correct me if I’m wrong, but didn’t you swear off all Russian woman permanently precisely because of their rabid prostitution and addiction to materialism?

    I guess you are implying that she is a green card bride. But you do so on little information, and I might add I see nothing wrong with that type of transaction anyway.

    I see everything wrong with that type of transaction. Not legally of course, since I’m a libertarian, but it is morally repugnant. The idea that a female master “gives ” you sex from an asexual position as a reward for being a “good boy” is toxic to a man’s self esteem. This is the world that men like Doclove, BlindIo, Heartiste, and Roosh want to get back to and I am sickened by it!

    As long as the guy remains Alpha these sorts of things work well, I hear.

    Alpha 1.0 who is more turned on by the perception of a woman’s obedience and less by her heterosexuality. He doesn’t mind if she fakes orgasms for money or frames sex as an asexual gift to him.

     

  129. @Paul:

    Ah look another “man up” post – this looks like it could have been written by a feminist.

    Dude, feminists want you to “man up” because they want to enslave you, especially as a tax payer! Those abortions and “fat positivity” courses aren’t going to fund themselves.

    BD wants you to man up so that you can be happy, not so you can do the bidding of any woman!

    I find it a little weird that you’re parroting standard textbook feminist grrl-power bs.

    That’s not what he’s doing. Regardless of whether you are a woman’s omega male slave, or your own happy alpha male, you need to man up. Without manning up, you can no more be enslaved by women than be happy with them. And this blog is about your happiness!

  130. @Bulma78:

    I go for the guys that work on cars instead.

    So a mental masturbator such as myself who enjoys intellectual stimulation and hates all physical labor (my gym habits notwithstanding) wouldn’t be your type.

    A cynical man would say that you like physical outdoorsy type men who work on cars and enjoy manual pursuits because you are subconsciously looking for a male slave who will fix all your shit for free and change your flat tires without you lifting a finger or taking out your credit card.

    But I’m sure that’s not you. 🙂

  131. How about a post on low cost businesses guys can start from home.  Most guys I know don’t play video games (I don’t myself), or if they do, it’s always in occasional moderation and never obsessively and never going overboard with it.

    They’d all be keen on making more money and/or starting their own business, but they’re not interested in direct selling or MLM bullshit where you’re selling overpriced products and most don’t have the funds to start a business and say you need money to make money, which is true mostly. 

    Not I’d want to do it, but of course if you buy a franchise, you’d need at least 500 grand, which most guys don’t have and depending on what it is, you’d be needing to work 7 days a week.

    I realise there’s either intellectual knowledge and/or creative talent based things (depending on what it is, that’s about making stuff that others like and want to buy) one can do from home, that don’t require any money, like computer programming or web design, but not everyone is into doing them and while you don’t need to go to university to learn how to computer programming or web design, that is how most people do, or they do a private course somewhere that’s more expensive, as self learning can be harder, if you’re not naturally gifted at it.

    The common sense suggestion, is if you’re in a shit job you don’t like and want to get out of, save your money and/or work 2 other jobs till you get the money.

    Property investing is something I’d like to get into, but there wouldn’t be much point in BD writing about it here, as the residential property market in the US, is quite different to how it is in overseas countries, where many readers here are from, as not everyone is in the US.

    Maybe not in the US, but the reality is, people who are making big money, are usually university educated professionals.
     

  132. P.S. Just what the fuck is “Pokémon Go?” Or “Pokemon” for that matter?

    Pokemon Go is a phone app where you “catch” fictional animals and battle other users of the app for their fictional animals. Before this existed there was regular Pokemon which is pretty much the same thing only your phone doesn’t detect the fictional animals and they are only in the video game itself. Nothing you wouldn’t expect from Japan, which is pretty much the MGTOW capital of the world lol.

    I mean I play video games as much as the next manchild, but with shit like Pokemon where you are pretty much trained to hoard stuff, I’m good lol.

  133. This comment is for you C-sucking Mother F-fer…….

    Don’t get me wrong, I have a job and make the break even for six figures, but things like living at home and not squeezing every last penny of labor out of myself keep me relaxed. Also living at home to save money is a good and honorable strategic choice.

    Ok I am a girl and this is my opinion.  Why would you want to live at home, especially if you are making at least $100K salary like you say? and keeping relaxed is not a good excuse.  Tons of people live on their own and don’t make nearly as much.  I don’t care how much a guy earns, but I’d NEVER date/sleep with a guy who didn’t have his own place at this point in life.  You could be a millionaire living with your parents and I wouldn’t give you one second of my time!

    Every moment the nagging thought of, “what should I be doing to get laid???” comes and goes, but the big payday is never coming. Average work does not even yield average results in game. It’s a winner take all landscape with very few winners. Not every man can be the Jamie Dimon of game no sooner than can every man be the CEO of a major bank.

    So let’s say you did meet a girl today…….where are you going to take her so that you guys can get cozy/have sex?  Your parents’ house?  You need to move out of your parents’ house a.s.a.p. and sign up for online dating and I think you’ll get some girls pretty quickly.  Living at home still is the ONLY thing holding you back.

  134. A cynical man would say that you like physical outdoorsy type men who work on cars and enjoy manual pursuits because you are subconsciously looking for a male slave who will fix all your shit for free and change your flat tires without you lifting a finger or taking out your credit card.

    But I’m sure that’s not you.

    Jack Outside the Box,

    Sorry, I knew someone was going to accuse me of that after I posted it!  Changing a flat tire is all I can actually do on my own and even then it’s not a breeze, other than that I’d be stranded.  But no, I’ve honestly never had a guy fix my car before. I’ve had a couple offer to if anything ever needed to be done and I said that was great and that I’d insist on paying them.  I did have a past boyfriend paint and fix up my bathroom, but I insisted on paying him to do the work and I did.  I don’t know why, it just makes me feel guilty to accept those kinds of big favors.  I mean, how else am I going to earn my keep if I’m accepting free favors and not able to give any of equal value in return?  I don’t think that sex or my adorable, charming presence is enough.

    I like those kinds of outdoorsy/car guys because for me it’s just a huge turn on and I find it super attractive!  I would still like you; I just meant I absolutely don’t like the lame, video-game obsessed, helpless guys.

  135. Sorry, but no cigar. I appreciate that you are trying to help, but I’d say it barely holds me back if at all. I know this because I usually push my interactions at bars/on dates and try to pull. It’s much more difficult than you might imagine to even get them to come along (I don’t mention my living arrangements). Then again just getting an audience with them (i.e. A date). Is hard and infrequent enough.

    I’m already on all the dating sites except PoF.

    Ex didn’t mind. It freed up tons of income to do other stuff/get nice accommodations and vacations. Plus you can use the savings to invest in hard assets (in NYC living in a halfway desirable neighborhood means blowing close to $30k/year). I totally get where you are coming from if you live anywhere but NYC though, that’s the general opinion I’ve heard from Atlanta transplants and even Chicago to some extent.

    My biggest problem has been relating to and having conversations with normies, I believe in the free market of ideas and hence have a short word filter/low tolerance for fools. Most of the stuff I read is alt-right/Machiavellian shit and some classical fiction/Bukowski. It’s hard to scale back some of the more rad stuff. I can’t stand the sports worship either (I like the gym and playing sports though so I’m not some noodle armed nerd either). Biggest problem though has been just getting girls to respond on the online dating profile which is quite sanitized. I don’t think my photos are that bad either.

    Some of the stuff BD has responded to in this thread has made me reconsider the money angle though, problem is similar to the poster above I’d couldn’t devote myself to working on some bullshit MLM business. I want to start a widget factory some day and make real shit, question is what widgets. I’d love to be a Texas Instruments style player. Then again I’m probably desiring that because of the respect I’d garner rather than some true love for production (although I really enjoy the how it’s made documentaries on discovery channel’s YouTube).

  136. In response to Bulma78:

    I’d enjoy fixing shit for free because it’s fun/it makes someone’s life better for not a whole lot of effort on my part. Also it creates a quid pro quo situation where if they have special skills id rather be paid that way than money (eg. Take me shopping and tel me how to dress cool). Fuck, when you’re lame even people’s company can feel good, but I guess that’s more about how “expensive” company is for you.

    Fixing shit for a woman is also fun (if you are fucking her) because it is inherently masculine and you feel a testosterone surge/you want to drill the shit out of her in your wife beater. Like the cable guy/auto mechanic fantasy. Men build shit. Little boys play with trucks. Girls break shit/bake. Little girls play with dolls. It’s just gender dimorphism and it’s more the modern world that distorts this. You can’t overcome human nature and human nature points to beta provider/feminine girl pairings. The structurally alpha environment of the 50s helped women feel attracted to their beta males because of incentives. Women are socially situationally attracted to things (since their attraction is perception based). Just because their ultimate attraction is some psychotic barbarian doesn’t mean it’s what we all should get/aspire to. Men are ultimately attracted to pornstar looking chicks, that don’t mean it’s dishonest when girls don’t all dress like pornstars.

    I probably fucked something up from a logic standpoint, but that’s my thoughts on the matter offhand.

  137. Oh sorry, I didn’t realize you lived in NYC!  You probably mentioned that above and I missed it.  Just trying to help/offer opinion/advice etc., yah, the cost of living is really high there, well even so, I’m sure BD wouldn’t approve, he’d still say to move out, haha!

     

  138. Then again just getting an audience with them (i.e. A date). Is hard and infrequent enough.

    Cry more.

    That’s all I’m saying to you.

    And yeah BD would tell you to move. NYC is one of the worst places on the planet to live. This is all your fault homie.

  139. I fully admit to not changing tires or doing anything car related.  I totally depend on males to do that sort of thing.  I’ve never even mowed a lawn before.  Shrug…   I’m more than happy to let men do those things.  They seem to like it, I don’t.

    I just can’t get into the whole androgynous thing.

  140. One thing I totally agree with is that it is terrible to be living at home as a man. But I disagree with the notion that no-one should be satisfied with living simply on a 30k a year income, especially if what they do to earn that fulfills them. Me personally, I’m earning between 30-40k a year by busking full time and doing the occasional gig, and I’ve never been happier. However I don’t live at home, and the struggling musician thing definitely doesn’t hinder my success with the ladies.

  141. @Bulma78 no sweats I know it’s all good intentions. Nerd question: Did you take your name from the Dragonball character?

  142. @Lovergirl:

    I fully admit to not changing tires or doing anything car related.  I totally depend on males to do that sort of thing.  I’ve never even mowed a lawn before.  Shrug…I’m more than happy to let men do those things.  They seem to like it, I don’t.

    I have people do my bidding as well (clean my house, wash my car, repair my car, change my tires, fix things around the house, etc…) because I refuse to do any of those disgusting and dirty physical things as well. The difference is that I compensate these people handsomely with my money.

    You, on the other hand……well….it must be nice to have a bunch of unpaid black slaves doing your bidding. And you pussy whip them too.

    I just can’t get into the whole androgynous thing.

    Why is it that everything that isn’t androgynous benefits women at the expense of men? Whereas everything that treats men and women equally well, or men fairly, is considered “androgynous?”

    Is there anything in your mind that is neither androgynous nor female supremacist?

  143. @Bulma78 no sweats I know it’s all good intentions. Nerd question: Did you take your name from the Dragonball character?

    Yes, correct! I used to be a Dragonball/Z/GT fan. I still love it; once in a great while I’ll pick up one of the books again, but it’s really just a fun thing of my past now. I just realized that Goku is kind of child-like himself? I mean he’s totally ripped and masculine but he’s so gullible and out there. Especially when Bulma’s mom is hitting on him; he’s so clueless!

    I fully admit to not changing tires or doing anything car related. I totally depend on males to do that sort of thing. I’ve never even mowed a lawn before. Shrug…I’m more than happy to let men do those things. They seem to like it, I don’t.

    I don’t blame you at all and I’ve never mowed a lawn before either. Changing a tire is really hard if you don’t have better tools than what they give you with the car and even with better tools it’s not super easy. I feel guilty having guys do favors for me, but if I was in a real jam/helpless I would have to give in.  I think I’d be apt to let a guy do this stuff for me if I lived with a guy, because then it would seem like a fair trade-off where I could grocery shop, cook, clean and wash the laundry.

  144. Don’t tell me your one of the 5 white chicks on earth who likes anime? **shrug** this is like the opposite of the conversation the blackdragon post was supposed to engender. Whatever. Thread hijack.

    You should watch the revived series, DB super. It replaces that GT garbage with canon, non plot hole ridden action. It’s about 50 eps in and going with some great new characters (and some old ones you never thought you’d see again.

    And yeah… I used to identify/aspire to be strongly like that Goku character. He was always all powerful and able to make things better, while still being very innocent/guileless. He was like everybody’s favorite uncle.

    I wish somebody would do a Donald Trump epic video of him walking up to Freeza (hilldawg) and muttering some America first platitudes. Like some of the parody videos with Trump and the 300 already out there. There’s some serious meme gold in there.

  145. Well, it sort of relates to this post and I’ll explain why. The thing is, I was into anime for about three years, but then I got my own place and all of a sudden it just didn’t interest me anymore.  After I moved out I had a lot more on my mind, like fixing up my new place; and I met a guy that lived in the next building and started seeing him.  Prior to that I lived at home, wasn’t dating anybody and spent my Saturday nights watching anime.  It was fun at the time, but after moving out I realized I was having way more fun.

    Moving out really is for the better and I’m not saying I dislike anime now, but it’s just not part of my life anymore.  There’s no doubt that Dragaonball Z is epic; it’s the best story ever!  I still have books, posters and dvd’s collecting dust in a box that I never want to part with.  These days, the only remains in sight that serve as evidence are two posters I have hung up and that’s it.  Moving out on your own allows you to really grow up and that’s not a bad thing.  I’m sure my parents would have let me live at home as long as I wanted, but I would have missed out on so much.

  146. Holy fucking shit i read “atlanta man”‘s posting and well done sir! He hit the nail on the head. Disclaimer: as of this second i haven’t read past that. But BD you sit there and spout all these things- true as they may be, and never consider the implications of what this man just said. The libtards and their pussy agenda basically FORCES men in this direction. Preach atlanta man!

  147. Update I’ve read some responses and I think I understand what is going on. Men are being told by society they are worthless, women consistently refer to them as “fuckboys” and they ever expanding wise US government is trying to force men out of the picture altogether. If you don’t understand the role the government plays here go read drudge report daily and read some books you are obviously not well read and young. BD on the other hand, is saying be successful for yourself- which I think is a great thing to say and good philosophy to live by. So really you have atlanta boy representing the majority of men in american society and BD representing the top 5% or whatever that are extremely ambitious. Both are right in their own way.

  148. BD,

    Can’t say I fully agree with your post here, and definitely can’t say I agree with your comments around only playing 1 hour of games/not played games in over a year. Rather than telling people to stop doing the things they love, why not tell them to structure their life so they can do the things they love, and have a good life, and have a good income??

    I make 6 figures, I play video games or watch youtube every day. I also got to Europe once every 2 – 3 years, for 5 – 6 months at a time and do the things you say we shouldn’t (smoke weed, drink lots, fuck around loosely, etc.). I also fluctuate between 10% – 12% body fat during any point in time. Every time I quit my job, go to Europe, and come back, the next job I find pays another $10-$15k more than the last.

    Humans work reverse logically, hence the more one says to ‘don’t do’, the more that person told not to, will do. Now I don’t believe you’ve ever been drunk or high BD, but some of the best times of my life will be those drunken/high days/nights, fucking around, talking shit, and just being a degenerate.

    The same can be said with having a 12 hour long LoL or Dota 2 session at a netcafe, with plenty of empty sodapop cans + takeaway containers in front of me and friends, then coming out of it going ‘holy shit boys, that was an epic night’!

    I’ve dated girls that complained about my gaming, huge net cafe sessions, ‘me time’, and etc. etc., but fuck em, because there are plenty of girls who like me for me. In my experience, deprivation creates unhappiness.

    Just my 2c.

    SB

  149. Rather than telling people to stop doing the things they love, why not tell them to structure their life so they can do the things they love, and have a good life, and have a good income??

    That is exactly what I do here.

    I make 6 figures, I play video games or watch youtube every day. I also got to Europe once every 2 – 3 years, for 5 – 6 months at a time and do the things you say we shouldn’t (smoke weed, drink lots, fuck around loosely, etc.). I also fluctuate between 10% – 12% body fat during any point in time.

    Then you are not the type of man I’m discussing in this blog post and have nothing to do with this discussion at all. You’re successful. I’m talking to the men who are not, and choose not to be. If you’re making a six figure income, travel the world, and have 10% body fat, you can play all the video games you want.

  150. BD your book is starting to becoming more appealing by the second. I don’t know much about you but from what I read here, I don’t think you’ve ever had a struggle with depression or the lack of drive. I don’t think you really understand it.

    Regardless, that’s not what I care about. Personally I’m not satisfied with my situation still fucking off in college for a (probably) useless degree and working part-time on the side. I wanted to know does your book help show how to make a good income using your interests?

    I’m more a creative type myself, I like writing fiction and drawing, shit like that.  Actually making money from that however…

     

  151. @ CocksuckingMotherfucker

    I’ve read a lot of your comments…you seem to come off as pretty jaded, negative and depressed.

    Question,

    Do you like to argue for argument’s sake or are you looking for help here?

     

  152. I don’t think you’ve ever had a struggle with depression or the lack of drive. I don’t think you really understand it.

    I have never had to struggle with depression, and you’re correct on that, I don’t understand it.

    I have indeed had to struggle with lack of drive, and I understand laziness very well. I have been lazy off and on throughout my life. Note that I am overweight despite years of trying not to be. Laziness is just like any other trait or problem; it must be managed, not surrendered to or made excuses for.

    I wanted to know does your book help show how to make a good income using your interests

    To a degree, yes.

    I’m more a creative type myself, I like writing fiction and drawing, shit like that.  Actually making money from that however…

    I mention that in the book. If your goal is to make a lot of money as a fiction writer, you’re probably out of luck. Instead, start a business or career that involves your 2nd favorite thing (something someone will pay you for) and write fiction for fun on the side.

    By the way, I do this. I’ve written three and a half fantasy novels, not to make money, but just for fun, while I write about stuff like this (which I also enjoy) for money.

  153. Hope I am not too late to the party here but I wanted to comment and say, why not combine some fun parts of adolescence and early 20s with success?

    Work on your career, make money, move out on your own, and take care of yourself. Yet, instead of settling down at the age of 30 and becoming a dad, live it up. Go to nice parties, sleep around with hot girls, and do those sorts of things.

    BD, I think it is a type of overcompensation happening due to a rise in helicopter parenting. Kids miss out on the drama and other things due to being sheltered in their teens and even early 20s in some cases so they want it now.

    I want to take my career very seriously and I have put forth the effort in it. The thing is, I just don’t want to be a “grown up” that gets married at 35 after she has had her fun and wants to find someone to settle down with. I want to sleep around, fuck hot girls, party, go to fun events, and yet work hard on my career.

    What are your thoughts on the Leonardo DiCaprios, Dan Bilzerians, Jack Nicholsons, and Hugh Hefners of the world?

  154. What are your thoughts on the Leonardo DiCaprios, Dan Bilzerians, Jack Nicholsons, and Hugh Hefners of the world?

    As I said above, the issue is not being a man boy. The issue is whether or not you’re really happy. Those four men you listed seem very happy to me, so in my eyes they’re doing just fine.

    Being a man boy while getting laid all the time, traveling the world, and making lots of money = good.

    Being a man boy while living at home with your parents, rarely or never getting laid, and making little or no money = bad.

  155. Black Dragon,
    Thank you so much for replying to my post and doing so soon. I do have one question though, and I guess it is in a way somewhat tied to me missing out on some of the fun in my teens and college years, it is about social life. How much tougher or easier is it going to get for guys to find a sense of brotherhood, social life, and community in the near future?

    People are taking longer to get married and settle down which IMO is somewhat of a good thing. As much as I find adolescents and college kids annoying, the one thing I love about them and hate about “adults” is that the younger age groups are very open to meeting new people, making friends, and engaging in high energy activities like partying.

    Do you think that the trends of today will make it easier for a 30 something bachelor to find his sense of brotherhood, friends, and community rather than being lonely?

  156. Do you think that the trends of today will make it easier for a 30 something bachelor to find his sense of brotherhood, friends, and community rather than being lonely?

    Its always been easy. Just join a gym or a recreational sports league. Most of my buddies I met through bowling leagues if they haven’t been childhood lifelong friends. Shit even chicks, if they are not what you want romantically and you don’t want to be their bf, just put them in the friend zone and hang out with them and their buddies.

    The problem with the common “manchild” is that their ego is so far up their ass that they think that there is some unseen force stopping them from succeeding or being happy. This has never been true and its never going to be true.

  157. How much tougher or easier is it going to get for guys to find a sense of brotherhood, social life, and community in the near future?

    I have no expertise in this area thus can’t answer that question. My wild guess is that technologies like Meetup.com will make this easier, but that’s only a guess.

  158. Good advice.

    I’ve been thinking about this a lot lately. I feel I’ve made good progress the last few years (I just turned 23). Since finishing high school five years ago I have:

    – a car

    – two degrees (nearly finished)

    – written a 6,000 word dissertation

    – written a novel (will see if it ever gets published)

    – had several published (paid) articles in reputable magazines

    – got rid of my glasses (laser eye surgery at 21)

    – dated several girls (longest relationship only lasted a few weeks, but still boosted my confidence massively)

    – lost my virginity (In a brothel, but still)

    – tried my hand at stand-up comedy, community radio, debating, footy training

    – saved up 30k from part-time work

    – started lifting/running regularly

    This is my last semester. I’m planning to do a CELTA course at the end of the year and head to China or somewhere else in East Asia. If I can’t get a job in law, teaching and writing might be the go, but we’ll see.

    I’m also looking with vague interest at Elon Musk’s plans to colonise Mars, and note that by 2030-odd (when the first colonists should be arriving) I’ll be in my late 30s – the perfect age.

    I’d friggin love to go to Mars someday.

     

  159. BD,

    I just have something to say: Just because someone stays at home for a long time doesn’t make them beta and a child. I am 43, and I never left home (although I don’t live with both parents. My mom passed away 24 years ago, so I am no mama’s boy). I have had several assorted jobs over the past 20 years, but nothing consistent because of various reasons (job got contracted out, site closed down, fired, etc…).

    I probably could have moved out if I wanted it bad enough, but in my county, that would probably mean taking two jobs (and I felt that it isn’t worth it to work 60 to 70+ hour weeks. It just compromises your health). I also applied for better jobs at certain factories and warehouses, but the fact that I have a degree may have actually hurt me as far as those jobs are concerned.

    In recent years, I have been thinking about ways to earn income without having a job, but the internet business market is usually littered with frauds, and at the end of the day, you usually don’t have a chance to do anything if you don’t have something that someone wants. In your recommendation, what would be the best way to go to make money online?

     

  160. John, many will read what you just wrote and will think you are delusional and a loser. You’re making a lot of excuses for not being a success and only losers make excuses (not winners). If you just got offended or your feelings are hurt, just remember… your feelings don’t change the facts.

    Here’s the answer BD will give you (from the article)….

    1. If you are over the age of about 24 and still live at home with parents, or make a low income, or spend a lot of time playing video games or getting drunk, GROW THE FUCK UP AND GET TO WORK. Stop being a goddamn child and make something of yourself. Build your financial empire so you can be happy and free. Getting my book would be a good start.

    Good luck!!!!!

     

  161. Just because someone stays at home for a long time doesn’t make them beta and a child.

    You’re 43 years old, still live with one of your parents, and can’t hold a consistent job. So yes, you are a beta and a child.

  162. “You’re 43 years old, still live with one of your parents, and can’t hold a consistent job. So yes, you are a beta and a child.”

    LOL…Damn, BD, just gave it to him straight, no chaser. I think he’s really going to be Butt hurt after your response.

  163. He can choose to grow up whenever he wants. Or he can keep making excuses. It’s completely up to him.

  164. If you are over the age of about 24 and still live at home with parents, or make a low income, or spend a lot of time playing video games or getting drunk, GROW THE FUCK UP AND GET TO WORK.

    Wow, there is a lot of profiling in this one. For one, I don’t spend that much time playing video games (only Madden, and I don’t play that very often). And, on top of that, I don’t drink that much. Also, on top of that, you make it sound like drunkenness is the sole province of the unemployed. That’s not the truth.

    You’re 43 years old, still live with one of your parents, and can’t hold a consistent job. So yes, you are a beta and a child.

    I know two guys with wives, families and jobs (well, one of them doesn’t have a wife anymore because she left him. This is the second wife that this guy has lost). I wouldn’t call them alpha. In addition, a lot of people can’t hold a consistent job nowadays. That’s called reality.

    It’s not 1960 anymore when you could go down to the plant or the coal mine out of high school and get a job (not that I would want those jobs). Me and my friend had a discussion about a plant in his old hometown. In the old days, he told me that you could get a job out of that factory after high school. Now, you need a degree in Metallurgy. No big deal, but the problem is that there are a lot of candidates for one job. I don’t try to complain or make excuses, but you have to keep it real.

     

  165. I know two guys with wives, families and jobs (well, one of them doesn’t have a wife anymore because she left him. This is the second wife that this guy has lost). I wouldn’t call them alpha.

    I never said get married. I’m saying get a job (or better yet, start a small business), make good money, and fuck lots of women.

    It’s not 1960 anymore when you could go down to the plant or the coal mine out of high school and get a job

    Read this, particularly item number 3.

  166. John… you missed the entire point of my response… how can you not see the obvious… I will try one last time to help you…..

    Getting my book would be a good start.

  167. I swear BD, sometimes you are too nice. Allow me. And JOTB I know you are out there, feel free to jump in. I know you would say something cute like “employing ‘red pill’ tactics NAO!!!” or something.

    My mom passed away 24 years ago, so I am no mama’s boy

    That means nothing. Was she not an influence on you as a kid? I’m guessing she was, and in a big way. Your victim-like discourse reveals that you are, indeed, quite possibly a momma’s boy. Also claiming that you aren’t a mama’s boy usually means that you are one, but just ashamed to admit it. Its like the “no homo” thing: Only a closet homo (and there are many) would say “no homo.” So just admit that you are at least a former momma’s boy.

    the internet business market is usually littered with frauds, and at the end of the day, you usually don’t have a chance to do anything if you don’t have something that someone wants.

    Those sound like excuses to me. And that ending part of the statement reeks of defeatist leftism. Are you a Sanders fanboy who just wants big momma guv to give you things without earning them? Are you invading here from tumblr or something? If you start telling people here to check their privilege, you’re gonna have a bad time. Just lettin ya know.

    a lot of people can’t hold a consistent job nowadays. That’s called reality.

    I’m a decade younger than you and I’ve had the same job for 8 years now. My mom has had the same job for almost 15 years. I don’t know anyone who hasn’t been able to hold down a job for at least one year. Since 2010. In South and Central Florida, where things are “worse than they have ever been.” One of my exes had exactly two jobs in her life, and got a job that pays her roughly $30000 a year 8 months ago. She’s 33. One of my other buddies went from being a deli manager at a supermarket, quit that job, and within weeks got himself a better job that paid him only slightly less.

    My lazy dumbass makes barely $20000 a year and I haven’t asked my parents for money once in five years. I also have college AND credit card debt but am in good standing with both (meaning I actually pay them.). I guess I’m “lucky.”

    I don’t spend that much time playing video games (only Madden, and I don’t play that very often)

    Oh not very often? So you aren’t that much of a neckbeard, and you certainly CAN’T be a neckbeard because you play “cool” video games like Madden, right? Can you not hide your shame, for once? Its so easy, I’ll do it right now! I play the same video games I did when I was a kid (Mainly Mega Man, Zelda, Dragon Quest, Final Fantasy franchises) and like the uber nerd I am, when I want to waste time I look up ways on how to beat said games faster and then try to do it myself (google “speedrunning,” that’s what I’m into). But I still work full time, write, play actual sports, lift weights, and get with chicks.

    And people think us millennials act like little kids.

  168. Read this, particularly item number 3.

    I read that. There is some truth to that excuse (the job stuff). However, I never said that it was OK to waste your life away smoking weed and looking at porn. I also haven’t given up in finding a job-better money making situation. I don’t feel sorry for myself.

    I never said get married. I’m saying get a job (or better yet, start a small business), make good money, and fuck lots of women.

    Fine. Sounds great. I am just saying that not all people with their own place, job, etc… are alpha.

    As for Joelsuf, you didn’t say anything of value. You are in Ad Hominem territory.

     

     

  169. I don’t feel sorry for myself.

    But you are trying to make excuses. Or else you wouldn’t be this defensive about your lifestyle choices.

    Instead of making excuses, you should say, “You know what? It’s not easy, but I should make more money. I should get my own place. I should get laid some more. I should probably get to work on that stuff.”

    I am just saying that not all people with their own place, job, etc… are alpha.

    I have never said that. I just said that men your age who still live at home with parents are betas. Because they are.

  170. you didn’t say anything of value. You are in Ad Hominem territory.

    I don’t need to say anything of value to call out a grown ass man a decade older than me who acts (and lives) like they are at least a decade younger than me. You don’t need value you need tough love.

    “You know what? It’s not easy, but I shouldmake more money. I should get my own place. I should get laid some more. I should probably get to work on that stuff.”

    That’s exactly what I’m saying to myself now. As much as I love my job, its not paying me enough to truly satisfy me. I got offered a job that pays slightly more, offers overtime, but it will be more supervised than my current job. So I may leave my current job for that one. It sucks, but I’m strongly considering it. As much as I enjoy casually dating, I need to start developing MLTRs even if they fail. Player lifestyle can only provide so much. I also need to start building my own empire this way I can just get paid passively for a significant amount of time (I imagine this is how BD set things up for himself). This is stuff that grown ass men think about.

    Only these aren’t a matter of “should” for some individuals, its a matter of “must.” If you still live with your folks (and aren’t helping them cuz they can’t take care of themselves or something) and you are over 25, its a matter of “must.” For someone like me who is already independent and just wants to be one ounce more successful, its a matter of “should.”

  171. Hey BD,

    I have been reading your blog for a couple of months and wanted to comment on this article of yours, even though it’s been over a year since you wrote it. I am not a gamer, I have my own place and I am not very career driven but that’s ok with me. I do work out and I have a university degree though.  Shame on me lol

    Even though you are right on the issue regarding the lazy man boy I don’t really get your intention for writing this article. It seems to me like you kind of dispise those man boys lives for some reason. Could it be that you are actually envying that kind of a lifestly those guys live while still getting pussy at times (I am talking about those guys who put playing video games above anything and actually get action with women if they feel like it) while you have to work hard for living your lifestyle and paying for your bills?

    You said you sleep with younger women who actually should be with guys their age, so why do you even care if it benefits YOU in the first place? You have said many times that your blog only applies to like 5% of all men who want to become Alpha 2.0 type of guys. Also you said that women are angry at those lazy guys so they end up with guys 10-15 years older than them. Could it be you don’t like the fact that they would rather sleep with them than you, if it wasn’t for their laziness and your financial advantage over them? Don’t get me wrong I am not trying to attack you personally, I am just assuming and trying to understand.

     

    “You should want to make more money FOR YOU, not for some woman! You should want to build a business FOR YOU, not for some woman! You should want to live in your own place and be a free man FOR YOU, not for some woman!”

    I highly disagree with this. And this is where I also disagree with MGTOW.

    Everything men do has to do with women. We make money to get pussy, I know this, you know this and every guy who has ever thought about this knows it as well. MGTOW says the same thing, make money for yourself and get the life you deserve, yet most if not all men use their money to get pussy! By doing that men actually attract what they hate the most, gold diggers! By making money you automatically become a provider, whether you like it or not. Sooner or later your money will attract a beautiful woman and you WILL fall in love and then you WILL hate her, all women and the world again once you got dumped or played one more time. You can’t help it, our natural biological needs are stronger than anything else.

    With that being said I always thought that most guys who make money or are very career driven are more beta type of guys than alphas. They use their money for affection and attraction, they become controlling and jealous as well, kind of like your Alpha 1.0. From what I know the Alpha 2.0 shouldn’t care what other people think of him, right? And he should only do what he wants, so why would he start to make money if he doesn’t feel like having a business, just because society or you BD are telling/advising him to do that? It doesn’t make sense to me. You say he will be happier. Well honestly, if I work less or earn less but are still able to get pussy then why would I work hard to get to the same result? If I could get a hot chick, just for a ONS, cause that’s all I need while you get the same chick by going out with her, driving in your fancy car (I am just assuming), then I feel like I have made the better deal by investing less. If you say that would be impossible for me to do, then you are actually confirming myself saying, that money is the reason you attract women and women are the reason for you to make money in the first place.

    As for money again: Imagine a world without women, like as if they disappeared tomorrow. How many guys would go to work, make money and go to the gym? Most would quit their jobs or just do a medicore job at best. They would get lazy and fat, maybe live from wealthfare just because there is nobody they can impress and sleep with anymore (unless they are gay). Do you think a millionaire could impress any guy if he showed him his new Ferrari? He would say nice toy dude, who are you gonna fuck tonight? lol

     

     

  172. You said you sleep with younger women who actually should be with guys their age, so why do you even care if it benefits YOU in the first place? You have said many times that your blog only applies to like 5% of all men who want to become Alpha 2.0 type of guys.

    I don’t think he said that they should be with guys their own age. I read another blog entry of his. He said that there have been young women that have been into older men in the past, and he said that the number is increasing in this modern world.

    In my opinion, that is good. This society is too focused on finding someone that is your age. My friend has said that (now, though, he is 50, and his girlfriend is around 34).

     

  173. @Sag: Honestly, you seem to live for external validations only mate, no wonder why BD’s post doesn’t make sense for you. That’s a dangerous/beta way of living, I would suggest buying his book The Unchained Man, or reading more on that topic.

    As for money again: Imagine a world without women, like as if they disappeared tomorrow. How many guys would go to work, make money and go to the gym? Most would quit their jobs or just do a medicore job at best. They would get lazy and fat,

    You are absolutely wrong, I (and many others, I believe) would still hit the gym frequently because I want to be in shape, not to show but to feel healthy and accomplished myself. I would still work on my income and net-worth because there are much, much more to enjoy in this life and this world than pussy (which is only a basic need, don’t pedestal it, you should look at Maslow’s hierarchy of needs)

  174. Leon

     

    I think you are totaly wrong most of you guys know it. If it wasn’t for pussy none of you wouldn’t even read this blog, let alone build their lives to become better. It’s just delusional to think life can offer much more than pussy, as wrong as it sounds. Let’s face it, we are slaves of pussy power.

  175. I think you are totaly wrong most of you guys know it. If it wasn’t for pussy none of you wouldn’t even read this blog, let alone build their lives to become better. It’s just delusional to think life can offer much more than pussy, as wrong as it sounds. Let’s face it, we are slaves of pussy power.

    Sag, you’re an idiot. Also, totally has two L’s, not one.

  176. Sag, you’re an idiot. Also, totally has two L’s, not one.

    Wow, I missed an L. lol

     

    And you are a weak pussy. But You will get it, once you become older dude.

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