This is such a big topic that it will likely be the first of several posts I make about this.
This will clear up a lot of confusion you may have regarding conflicting advice in the seduction realm. Few men are aware that in terms of men who engage in seduction as a lifestyle or pastime, there are two types. These two types of men are both Alphas, both successful, and both have the same goal, that of having sex with women, ideally multiple women and ideally faster rather than slower.
However, the way these two types of men go about how they find and seduce women is very, very different. Often these types of men will get into huge arguments about the “right” way to date / seduce / be in relationships with women.
I have always called these two types of men Thrill of the Hunt men (TH men) or Pleasure of Sex men (PS men).
Before I describe each, it’s important to understand three things:
1. Neither type is any better than the other. They’re just different. As you’re about to see, there are a lot of pros and cons to both types.
2. Both types of men are Alpha males. Both types can be skilled at seduction and/or relationships. Both are “cool”.
3. As you read through the descriptions of these two types of men, I promise you that the majority of you are going to think, “I’m a little bit of both.” While it is true that many men have some TH and PS traits, you are not “both”.
No. No matter how much of both you have, one of them is stronger in you than the other. That being said, some guys can be extreme in their style (TH or PS) and some guys just be “standard” in their style. The point is you have a “dominant” style.
The Difference Between The Two
PS men desire sex. They don’t care how they get it as long as it’s easy, quick, and not a lot of trouble. For TH men, the hunt is just as important as the sex, if not more so.
That’s really it…but it’s a big difference.
TH men are always pushing themselves to the limit, trying to accomplish difficult lays. Scoring a gal who was a really hard lay is a huge source of pleasure for them. The harder the lay, the more they had to work, the more they had to push themselves, the better they like it. Whenever you read about a 45 minute bathroom lay at a club, you’re likely reading about a TH man. Whenever you read about a guy battling a chick’s reluctant ASD for hours to score that SNL, you’re likely reading about a TH man.
On the other hand, PS men just want to get laid. They want to get to the sex as easily as possible without a lot of hassle, even if the methods they use are considered “boring” or “too easy” or “not game”. They just want the sex…they don’t give a shit about the hunt. As a matter of fact, extreme PS men consider the hunt as tedious and a pain in the ass. They’ll do it, but only to get laid. Once they get laid, then they’re happy. Again, they don’t care how they get it. They just want it. Whenever you read about a guy talking about how great Tinder is, or how great Facebook is for getting have sex with exes, you’re likely looking at a PS guy.
TH men view the process of seduction as fun and thoroughly enjoyable. PS men view the process of seduction as a necessary evil. Either approach can be effective. One wants to push himself to accomplish great things, the other wants to get laid as fast and easily as possible.
TH men tend to have very strong game. They know how to get laid under all kinds of conditions. TH men are hardcore players, and will often stay in sarging mode for long stretches, often measured in years. They love one night stands and get sexually bored with women reasonably fast. Their relationships with women tend to be brief and non-serious (FBs). When they actually get into serious relationships, they tend to cheat. (More on this in a minute.) They are constantly striving to improve and push the envelope, and take great pleasure in their successes.
On the other hand, PS men game just enough to get laid and create a relationship or two, and that’s it. They don’t push for constant improvement in their game like TH men. Rather, they only master their game enough to work well in one or two key areas they’re comfortable with, and that’s all. They sarge for new women only when they really need to do it, tending more towards relationships (sometimes monogamous, sometimes open/poly; it depends on the guy and where he is in life).
Game Styles Preferences
TH men naturally gravitate towards styles of game that are “harder”, like club game or street game. They disdain things like online game or going out on “dates”. Style (Neil Strauss), who back in his prime was a hardcore TH guy, once wrote that he tried online game, had sex with five women in a row very fast, and then stopped doing it.
Why? It was “too easy” he said. As a TH man, he didn’t want the hunt to be easy…that ruins the whole point for them. They often look down at guys having sex with women on the second date for example, because to them that’s “too easy” and “doesn’t require any game”.
PS men are the exact opposite. They will gravitate towards game styles that are “easier” or more low-key, like online game and indirect daygame. Once they find a seduction method that works for them, they will likely stick with that method and not bother to learn any other methods.
Reaction To ASD
When a TH man encounters ASD, he gets very excited at the challenge and will dive right in. He will happily spend hours battling ASD to win his prize.
When a PS man encounters ASD, he might try a thing or two, but if they don’t work, he bails fast and is off to the next gal. PS men despise women who are “bitches” or “too much work”.
Whenever a TH man gets monogamous, for a while he likes it, but soon he gets very uncomfortable because he’s out of the hunt. Because of this, TH men tend to be cheaters, cheating on women as a regular practice, even if they truly love the woman they’re with and feel bad about what they’re doing. TH men need to hunt. TH relationships almost always tend to end up being either very short-term serial monogamist ones, or “monogamous” relationships where he’s cheating, either in secret (so she doesn’t know) or not in secret, putting up with an angry but tolerating girlfriend or wife.
(A friend of mine calls these “Mad Men Marriages”…in my ebooks I call them “Mediterranean Marriages”; a high-drama marriage where the husband cheats, the wife knows it, hates it, and bitches about it constantly, but stays with the husband anyway because of logistical, financial, family, or religious reasons.)
There are some TH men who master open/poly relationships, but for some reason most TH men tend to avoid these, preferring the perceived security of “monogamous” relationships, even if they’re short-term and/or if they’re secretly cheating.
PS men are very different, both in good ways and bad.
On the bad side, they tend to get into relationships must faster than TH men and also tend to get needy and oneitisy faster. PS men tend to be much more “relationshippy” than TH men. (Many TH men don’t even like talking about relationships in detail and often consider it pussy-talk, even if they currently have a girlfriend of their own). PS men also tend to put up with more crap (i.e. drama) from a woman they’re with than TH men, who will just use it as an excuse to next the woman and get right back into the hunt.
On the plus side, when PS men man-up, get some outcome independence, and learn relationship skills, they can easily create a lifestyle where they get the sex they crave as easily as they like, living much more even-keel lives than their often chaotic TH brothers.
Disagreements Between The Two Types
TH men tend to view PS men as pussies, betas, or lazy. They view PS men as not wanting to push themselves to be better men. Whenever you see a club game guy bash online game, this is the dynamic you’re seeing.
PS men tend to view TH men as teenage-like, validation-seeking, or time-wasters. Whenever you see a guy on a PUA forum telling another guy to “grow up”, or say something like “Dude WTF? Why did you stay up until 3am to fuck so-and-so when you could have just fucked so-and-so in probably an hour? That’s dumb!”, this is the dynamic you’re seeing.
Many times, arguments in the seduction community and manosphere often are not about the actual topic being discussed. The disagreements might look like it’s about game style or technique or psychology, when in fact it’s simply a demonstration of the sheer difference between how TH men and PS men view the world of women.
As I said, there is no right or wrong side here. Both types of men have good points. It will be no surprise to learn that I myself am an extreme PS guy. Many years ago I had some very big arguments with some TH guys, until I realized what was going on. That’s when I stopped arguing with TH guys, acknowledged that how they viewed the process of seduction was very different than me, and moved on.
The TH man who is constantly pushing others to strive and improve does have a point. The PS man who thinks it’s stupid to stay up until 4am at a club on a weeknight just to get laid also has a point. They’re both right, just looking at things very differently.
Where Do You Fit In?
It’s very helpful to identify yourself. You’re either a predominantly TH man or a PS man. Yes, you may have aspects of both, but you’ll have a dominant one. Once you figure out what type of guy you are, you should be congruent with that.
TH men should always stay in the hunt. Always! The minute you get taken out of the hunt (due to monogamy or complacency or despondency) is the minute you start to implode, and often get depressed. You should also strongly consider never getting absolutely monogamous (unless you enjoy drama).
PS men should never feel pressured to learn game styles or techniques that seem “cool”. They should do what works for them, not whatever the current PUA / manosphere trend is. More importantly, PS men should never settle for one magical pussy, and as a PS man you’ll be very tempted to do this. They should always be aware that ALL RELATIONSHIPS ARE TEMPORARY and you should always be honing your skills.